The Suspended Walleye Revolution

[Toad]

Guys,

Just a quick note about an unbelievable (and untapped) bite that's just begun to develop over the past few nights . . . trophy walleyes feeding on ciscoes, 15 to 25 feet down over 90 to 100 feet of water.

Last night, between 8pm and 11pm we put 11 walleyes in the boat, five of them were between 25 and 28-inches.

Here's the pattern-- Get out on a deep, clear lake with lots of dwarf ciscoes (3 to 6-inches). Toward dusk, look for signs of ciscoes dimpling the surface. Last few nights we've trolled with 300 feet of 14/4 Fireline and #7 to #9 Shad Raps, blue & white or blue & chrome.

We'll talk more on all this soon. But just wanted to give you fine folks a heads-up on what may well be the best trophy walleye pattern there is. For now, I'm on my way up to Deer River . . .

-a friend called Toad

[Guest]

I have been following a similar pattern on the Red River. Yep, suspended mid-summer walleye on rivers, weird idea EH?

Forage is key, A-Z forage will show you were the piggy's are on any given day.

I need more time on it to say for sure it is a real pattern or just a miss read application of a presentation, then I will share when I feel more confident in it's repeatability.

Great topic Toad!

------------------
Ed "Backwater Eddy" Carlson
Backwater Guiding Service
10409 Co. Rd #17 S
Horace, ND. 58047

[email protected]

1-(701)-281-2300

[Jim W]

Great topic indeed. I was on Green Lake a couple weeks ago when the Cisco were on the surface feeding on the Mayflies! Hmmmmmm. Maybe we should have tried for some suspended daddios?

[Toad]

Wanted to follow up a bit after my hurried initial post on this topic. Over the past several years on this suspended walleye pattern, a few other items of note have revealed themselves. (For the whole lowdown on this pattern, take a look at the June/July 1999 issue of In-Fisherman).

1) There are suspended walleyes in most every lake I've ever been on. About 50% (or better) of these lakes definitely contain fishable populations of open-water walleyes.

2) In 90% percent of these cases, these suspended fish run much larger in size than your typical structure-related walleye. In the lake I've been fishing this season, the average walleye on structure runs about 17-18-inches. The suspended fish we've taken have averaged 24 to 26-inches. The largest so far went 28".

3) Best to fish this pattern during the week. On weekends, boat traffic stirs and rips up a lot of weeds and debris. This makes trolling 300+ feet of line exceedingly difficult-- you always seem to catch these bits of flotsam on your line, rendering your lure ineffective. You're always having to reel in and clear your lure. Two solutions are to either run a small split shot several feet ahead of the lure to defract the debris, or run a side planer, which is a good idea in any case. Most importantly, though, excessive boat traffic appears to drive these near-surface ciscoes deep, where walleyes and trophy pike are less likely to use them as a food source.

4) Don't be afraid to use big lures. The other night, we had our best success with big Cisco Kids-- normally thought of as a pike & musky lure. Another great lure is the old Mag Rapala, the one with the metal lip. Finally, the new Normark Tail Dancer has been a producer.

5) You'll be much more likely to trigger strikes with changes in boat speed, as well as directional shifts and turns. I believe these openwater fish often follow lures for perhaps minutes at a time. They often won't strike until the lure changes in speed or direction. Can't tell you how many times I've seen this happen.

. . . and more! For now though, I want to know how many of you fellas out there have experienced this pattern. Ed, when you've seen walleyes suspend in the river, what were they primarily feeding on. Jim, yes, take a few runs through those cisco schools on Green-- it's a prime lake for openwater trolling. You might get on a big walleye pattern no one else is fishing. And most people won't believe you, either!

This is perhaps one of the last truly great frontiers in walleye fishing. It's happening right now, so in the meantime, you know where I'll be . . .

-a friend called Toad

[Toad]

Hi Flick,

Big walleyes absolutely feed on tulibees (tulibees and ciscoes are the same thing). As do big pike, lake trout, smallmouth bass . . .

In the evenings when you're on this lake, watch for signs of ciscoes jumping at the suface. As you suggest, they're coolwater fish and seek deep, cool water during the day. But toward dusk, they begin rising in the water column where they cross paths with walleyes above the thermocline.

If you see these jumping ciscoes, you can be sure there are big walleyes and pike below, feeding on these critters. Also, take a look at the DNR's Lakefinder feature and look up your lake; the survey will reveal the size structure of every species of fish in the lake, including ciscoes. The 3 to 8-inchers are ideal walleye forage size, though they'll definitely eat larger ones too.

Let me know how it goes for you. I've been curious about this pattern on a number of lakes around G Rapids for years. Think Trout Lake and Wabana could be hot. Only really done it on Deer Lake, though. A 6 and an 8-pounder pretty much told me all I needed to know there. Keep in touch!

-a friend called Toad

[Flick]

Toad-I read that article and it was pretty intersesting. I've also gone to the DNR webiste a number of times and looked at the info for the lake. In the article the guy says he looks for ciscoes that average a 1/2 lb. or less. In this lake they average a lb. There's a lot of them though. We've seen the bottom just covered with them on the graph, so many hooks it was just black. And I think we've seen them hitting the surface. Although it's not just in the evening and more often than not they come totally out of the water, they're not bass, but maybe not ciscoes either? While we were there last week a guy told us a story where he saw something splashing on the surface, so he went over there and saw a huge northern. It had a big cisco stuck in it's throat and couldn't get it out. It finally did and swam away. Unfortunately I don't live near any good walleye lakes, so I can't go try this in the evenings. Keep posting on how you do. Thanks

[Toad]

Ciscoes very often jump clear out of the water-- kinda look like little dolphins. And you're right, they sometimes do it during the day also. Of course, not knowing what lake you're on, you could be right, maybe they're not ciscoes at all. My guess, though, is that if you're seeing this happen out over real deep water, they probably are ciscoes.

By the by, the "guy in the article" and Toad are actually one and the same. Me! Enjoy your fishing now. And you can bet I will continue posting new findings, etc.

-a friend called Toad

[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 06-25-2001).]

[Guest]

Great info Toad!

In response to your question on the probable forage on the Red that the high hunter walleye are following, I know for sure one is the Goldeye.

They find any new year class of fish that will ball up a good target. Carp, drum, bullhead, river shiner and golden river shiners can all be a target of opportunity.

So depending on what the currant flow situation may be any of the likely suspects may end up in a piggy walleye's belly. This is a prime reason rivers grow sumo piggy type walleye, lots of food to chose from.

The ability to switch to another forage is a key factor in consistent growth and sustained trophy class fish. Systems that are overly dependent on one forage are fragile and susceptible to a crash. A Crash like the Oahe system has suffered in SD when the smelt population plummeted after the "97" emergency flood releases. Stunted fish with a poor chance of trophy fish is the result, bad deal!

Summer is often thought as the slow time of year on most river systems but yet the largest seasonal growth spurt is under way, something just didn't jive there for me? They are feeding big as well as often but not were we "Thought" they should be. If the piggy don't come to the trough then they are most likely eating somewhere else.

Crank's are often key to locating suspended fish and also prove to be the most efficient method to search for them. Big bad noisy cranks run were the food is or just below the food.

We need to find the food first either by sight or by the use of electronics, then work the bait ball area again, and again, and again tell you find a feeder.

If your lucky you may see a few walleye on the flasher hanging in mid water or on the cruise, but don't count on it! They shuffle off to the side I think and out of the way of most electronics field of vision. I use a BottomLine unit that has side finder left and right as well as down, and over time this has clued me in on this piggy shuffle routine. This unit is also darn handy to locate bait balls even at high speed, a handy deal Eh.

I am still trying to understand if they spend short or long periods of time in this high hunter mode? So far I have seen it in mid day as well as in the dead of night in mid summer. I do feel confident on one assumption, it is all about food. There may be a connection with water temperature but I am not so sure of this yet, we will see?

A interesting pattern that we all should keep in mind for sure. Anyone with other thoughts or observations on this feel free to share them.

[This message has been edited by Backwater Eddy (edited 06-25-2001).]

[Flick]

Toad-Do you think they'd feed on tulibees. A lake I fish in the Grand Rapids area has quite a few tulibees and some big eyes. We even caught a tulibbe when we fished for them last week in 60 feet of water. You could see them on the graph. The one we caught was pretty good size for an eye though. There has to be smaller ones mixed in with the school though. They were near bottom during the middle of the day but do you suppose they rise up at night? I have a feeling I could get into some monster fish doing this. Thanks.

[Toad]

Hey Flick,

Thanks for the kind words. Biggest walleye I've taken trolling openwater was a 29-incher. I know there are much bigger fish out there, just a matter of time . . .

The name "Toad" is in commemoration of an old friend of mine, Otis "Toad" Smith. The real Toad was one of my 'heros' as a lad, for he could shoot an arrow, skin a buck and catch catfish better than anyone I've seen, before or since. Plus, he had that always optimistic, good-natured way about him that endeared him to everyone, even despite his sometimes questionable practical jokes.

In 1991, Toad died while trudging through deep snow to retrieve a pair of pheasants he downed with a single shot. I last fished with Toad early that same fall on the Raccoon River in Iowa. Though we caught few catfish, it was one of my greatest memories fishing. Other than my father, Toad Smith continues to be what I aspire to be, both as a person and an outdoorsman.

So maybe I wouldn't have normally spouted on so long about Toad, but ironically, I just today learned of another favorite fishing friend who died yesterday. Good fishing buddies are rare; the best of them make the finest friends you'll ever have.

-a friend called Toad

[Flick]

Sorry to hear that.

[Guest]

Otis Smith was also a hero of mine. I would have been honored to have known him as a friend, your lucky to have been his friend Cory. I always suspected that is were you gained the handle Toad? Seams to fit ya too.

I am also very sorry to hear about your friend that has passed on, maybe him and Otis are on to some fish somewhere?

Backwater Eddy.......><,,>

[Flick]

Toad, also do you use boards when you troll, or are they too much of a hassle. I've never used them. Thanks

[Flick]

Toad-You did a great job on that article. It must be awesome being able to write for In-Fisherman. What's the biggest eye you've gotten out of "Lake B", or anytime trolling suspended eyes? Also how did you come up with the name Toad? I've wondered that ever since I've seen it. Talk to you later. Flick

[Toad]

Thanks fellas,

Had to go fishing last night, 'cause, well, you know-- that's what a guy like me does, both in thick and thin. The openwater thing wasn't great, but managed a 29" pike and two 26" walleyes-- the pike on a Tail Dancer and the 'eyes on #9 Shad Raps. Think the hot weather has driven many of the fish deeper.
---------
Flick,

Yep, I use boards most of the time. Reasons are threefold-- to provide a wider horizontal lure spread, to get the lure away from the noisy boat and to deflect floating weeds and debris from your lure. Last night that was a huge problem, with all the pleasure craft out there, tearing up weeds like little buzzsaws.
----------
Ed,

Interesting info on the river pattern you're talking about. So, when you say 'suspended,' are these fish feeding just below the surface? Mid depth in the water table? This has gotta be some pretty intense walleye fishing if they're active enough to battle the open current. Though, I suppose it could be a slack water thing too, where casting cranks, rather than trolling, is the key presentation.

I've done real well upstream trolling in the Mississippi for summertime walleyes. Although it's normally an approach that focuses on the bottom couple feet of the river, rather than nearer the surface.

This is all really exciting, potentially groundbreaking stuff we're talking about here. Keep us posted on your findings.

I'll be out filming TV segments with Steve Hoffman of In-Fisherman over the next week or so. Let you fellas know how we fare.

-a friend called Toad

[Guest]

Toad tell Hoffman the next time he wonders over this way I'll feed him this time, (HA), he will know what I talking about I think.

Hay, Ask him if he has tried cheddar cheese on hot apple pie lately, then he will remember for sure!

HA!!

Say Howdy to Jeff S. too. Tell him I have a frog all picked out for him already, it is in training for the fall frog olimpics.

Good luck on the shoot.

BE.....><,,>

------------------
Ed "Backwater Eddy" Carlson
Backwater Guiding Service
10409 Co. Rd #17 S
Horace, ND. 58047

[email protected]

1-(701)-281-2300

[Guest]

I believe I saw you and your fishing partners at the dock when you got back in the night you scored on the big walleyes. We also found the same pattern there on Lake Bertha. The walleyes were hanging over 50' of water feeding, it took most of my vacation but I finally found them. If you don't remember me I was the one that spoke to you about going to CSU. I was out from Colorado with my family. We have walleyes in the reservoirs out here but not in the same numbers. Good fishing and good luck.

[Toad]

Wow. The world's getting smaller all the time. Glad you found some fish out there.

By the way, how's good ol' Horsetooth Reservoir these days?

[Guest]

Horsetooth is just a puddle. They drained the reservoir to repair the dam. They say that it will be empty for 2 more years. Last year when they were draining it they removed all limits on the fish and cleaned them out. It will take a few years befor it is back to normal. I would like to thank all the locals around Whitefish lakes for all the hositallity shown to my family an I when we were on vacation up there last week. We will return again next year. Good fishing and good luck.

[Guest]

Toad-
Are you finding this trolling method to work primarily during the low light periods, like dusk/dawn or after dark? How about during the day? I have never tried trolling during the day.
I am getting into trolling more, especially after tonight when I pick up a kicker motor for my boat. I just could not produce fish at 3.5 mph (the trolling speed of my boat with the big motor).

Thanks.

[GullGuide]

All I have to say is....
DUDE, WHY DID YOU HAVE TO HIT THE JACKPOT THE SUMMER AFTER I MOVED!!!!!
Oh well......
>"////=<

[Toad]

CD,

Noticed you've spent some time on Roosevelt. This open water trolling thing can be hot on this lake. Look for suspended clouds of ciscoes, then little ciscoes dimpling the surface over the deep basin around dusk.

On the lakes I've fished this pattern, twilight certainly focuses activity. Yet earlier in the season it can also be a daytime thing because the epilimnion (upper surface layer) is still cool enough to support ciscoes all day long. Again, if you see signs of life suspended high during the day, you'll have walleyes keying in on them.

The main reason it's a low light thing in summer is that ciscoes spend most of their time below the thermocline (walleyes won't go below the thermocline once lake stratification occurs). Only later in the day do ciscoes usually rise high; it's then that walleyes and other gamefish cross paths with these high protein morsels.

So in most deep, clear lakes, it's the two to three hours surrounding sunset that you want to focus your fishing. Hey, let me know if you get into some fish on Roosie doin' this. I'll be there in about a week. Take 'er easy.

-a friend called Toad

GG- You've got cats down there . . . I'll trade ya! (fish, that is)

[Toad]

Well, the open water pattern continues . . . Yesterday, following this most recent period of super hot temperatures, we found walleyes (and pike) feeding from 3 to 10 feet below the surface over 80+ feet of water.

The water weather has spurred a big algae bloom, which has drawn plankton and ciscoes up near the surface late in the day. In some cases, we actually observed big fish slashing pods of ciscoes right through the surface film.

Yesterday's score included five walleyes (3-26 & 27-inchers) and three pike up to 33-inches. Best baits were #7 Shad Raps and #13 Jointed Rapalas. Faster trolling at 2 to 2.4 mph produced every strike. One of our big walleyes hit so hard that the planer board actually jumped clear of the water and smacked back down with a loud "CLAP!" Wish we woulda caught that on film.

Time now for a little muskie fever.
See you boys at Cass!

-a friend called Toad

[Guest]

Thanks Toad! You are right, I do spend time on Roosie. I will be there this week, Thurs. through the weekend. I am going to try this method and see what I can do.

If you're going to be there, maybe I'll run into you.

[Scoot]

Toad,

You mentioned earlier that a lake with a good population of ciscos could produce this bite- what is your definition of a good population of ciscos? The lake I have in mind is White Earth lake- I know it has a decent number of them, but I'm wondering if it would fit the type of lake you're describing. I think it would.
Scoot

[Toad]

Hi Scoot,

White Earth is definitely one of those lakes. Good depth with cool, well oxygenated waters-- perfect for supporting ciscoes.

Spend some time out over the deeper basin areas with your LCG. You should be able to spot big hooks near the clusters of ciscoes.

And when you do get into a herd of those log-sized walleyes (you will eventually, you know), I'd sure like to hear about it. Will be doing a follow-up article on this pattern for In-Fish soon. Any info is new info on this deal; going where few have gone before and all . . . (Someone's gotta do it.) Enjoy your fishing!

-a friend called Toad

[mouse]

Toad: I discovered a similar pattern up on Man Lake about 8 years ago. Happened to be trolling a Bucher Depth Raider across 50' of water, about 8pm, when the depth finder turned black with baitfish about 25' down. Seconds later there's a fish on, pulling like a beast. We're expecting to see a muskie, 'cause Man Lake does not have a reputation for walleyes, I've never caught a small one there. When we finally get the fish to the boat we see a monster walleye. That fish was 32" and went back into the lake.
Since that time I fish the same pattern, about 4 nights, during 1 first week of August. I catch a couple of big walleyes each year doing the same thing, as well as several Muskies, 2 over 48", and several pike, 1 over 42". I've caught all of the fish on Jointed Bucher Depth Raiders with about 200' of 30# Ripcord line. I've also snagged a few Ciscoes along the way. I thought maybe I just got lucky for a year or two, but found I've discovered a good thing. Trouble is I only get a chance to do once a year. Try the Depth Raiders sometime. You might like'em.

[Toad]

mouse,

Hey thanks for the input! Great stuff. I've never been on Mann, though I've tried (twice unsuccessful) getting under the bridge between Baby and Mann. All these muskie lakes in the Longville area should offer this pattern-- both for walleyes and muskies. And as you say, the fish are almost always big. Inguadona, Woman, Little Boy, Wabedo . . .

Can see where the Depth Raiders should be producers (I'll have to try 'em)-- some of my bigger openwater fish have taken Cisco Kids and big Magnum Rapalas. How deep are you running? 20 - 25'?

Again, thanks for sharing your pattern. Thanks, too for putting those big fish back. This is perhaps the last frontier of truly huge fish in our waters. Keep in touch.

-a friend called Toad

[mouse]

Toad: In response to your question about depth. Yes, 20-25' seems to be the rule, but last year for some reason about 18' seemed to work better. I don't own a line counter reel so knowing exactly how much line I have out, or how deep my lure is running is sometimes a challenge. I have a pretty good handle on the depth raiders. If I switch to another lure I'd have go through some more trial and error. Got any suggestions on determining the depth that a particular lure is running.

If your interested in trying Man you can drop your rig in at Wildwood Beach Resort. Tom and Sherry are great people. They've got a pretty good ramp, and I think the cost is about $6. My family and I will be up there from July 29-Aug.4. Maybe we'll bump into each other.

[Rick]

Hi,
if you're interested in knowing exactly how deep you're trolling with specific lures/weights, check out Precision Trolling-The Trollers Bible
http://fishingminnesota.com/precision_trolling.html

[This message has been edited by Rick (edited 07-03-2001).]