Gov Dayton

[Kidd]

So who is paying for the trains?

[Uncle Bill]

Right, so Johnsons idea of selling bonds to pay for road improvements is more efficient than Dayton's pay as you go?

Last legislative session:

90 million on the s.l.o.b.

11.4 million to fill pot holes.

priorities ??

Or pizz poor management of our tax revenue.

[Kidd]

Stay focused Uncle Bill, stay focused. Do I need to go back to the Pawlenty years to display examples of irresponsible government spending? This discussion is about the two Governor candidates response to paying for road infrastructure repair: Dayton wants pay as you go where Johnson wants to put the expense on the state charge card. We as voters need to decide who we want making that decision, and I favor the pay as you go. We're already in debt I can't see hiring a governor that wants to continue that trend.

[aanderud]

This discussion is about the two Governor candidates response to paying for road infrastructure repair: Dayton wants pay as you go where Johnson wants to put the expense on the state charge card. We as voters need to decide who we want making that decision, and I favor the pay as you go. We're already in debt I can't see hiring a governor that wants to continue that trend.

I think Johnson wants to skip the Southwest light rail and spend that on infrastructure repair. So, no more would be put on the "state charge card" than is going to be put on there today. Probably less, in fact.

Since that light rail will require operating expenditures EVERY YEAR after it is built (rider fees will not come close to paying for it, probably only hitting 10-15% of operating expenses) explain to me how your governor's actions will result in LESS debt?

[amateurfishing]

I think Johnson wants to skip the Southwest light rail and spend that on infrastructure repair. So, no more would be put on the "state charge card" than is going to be put on there today. Probably less, in fact.

YOU THINK!!???

It was johnsons way of attempting to get the same agenda accomplished so he would not have to look bad and say no to fixing infrastructure and at the same time claiming he will not raise taxes to get things done but in reality he is doing the exact same thing that dayton proudly stands for and has the guts to admit while johnson (and rest of party) hide behind a play on words.

Johnson did not say skip light rail.

[amateurfishing]

Last legislative session:

90 million on the s.l.o.b.

11.4 million to fill pot holes.

priorities ??

Or pizz poor management of our tax revenue. confused

I sure hope you are not referring back to when t-paw, zellers, and co. Forced a govt shutdown and stole from the teachers and education system to run with the mantra "we did not raise taxes"..........speaking of poor management.....

[amateurfishing]

Im not sure what costs are involved with road projects (mainly labor and materials) but I bet these 2 costs have risen exponentially over the years similar to health care to the point that you no longer receive fair value for your given construction dollar considering unions and lots of state workers and pensions involved. I could b off base but not far I dont think.

[Kidd]

I think Johnson wants to skip the Southwest light rail and spend that on infrastructure repair. So, no more would be put on the "state charge card" than is going to be put on there today. Probably less, in fact.

[amateurfishing]

Very true, loved the no talk ventura style!

[Eric Wettschreck]

AF, we know you're rather fond of Dayton and the Dem party, but Minnesota's last government shutdown was in 2011. Mark Dayton was governer not T-Paw.

Carry on.

[JP Z]

Oh no he didd-ent!

[Eric Wettschreck]

Since we're Piling on the gov, my wife had to interview him the other day as he's heading to Worthington for the phesant opener. It was on the radio.

Good Lord. I'll try to sum up what he said. This isn't word for word, just what I could get out of the conversation. Here we go. Ahem.

Wife- Gov, how you doin?

Gov- Onljfdlkd lkkjdfflks aojd. Aomajkd oafd akld.

Wife- Are you looking forward to coming to Worthington?

Gov- Alkdsfj kdfa akldf adkl wiown afksdj and somethin I think was Japanise.

Wife- You have roots in Worthington, don't you?

Gov- Akljdf ajldsfa ioeur iaiofu Something Swedish adlkfjsl afsdklj afjkldf.

Things went down hill from there.

[amateurfishing]

AF, we know you're rather fond of Dayton and the Dem party, but Minnesota's last government shutdown was in 2011. Mark Dayton was governer not T-Paw.

Carry on.

Sorry Eric but I did not state "last govt shutdown" in that comment you are referring to because it was not meant to, juzt referring to budget balancing acts by others. But since you mentioned it, yez Dayton was gov during last govt shutdown and dont forget he waz also the one that stopped it feeling bad bout all the great folks that were out of work ( once again because of zellers & co inability to negotiate, remember was,all about tea party back then, my way or highway) and gov Dayton conceded on most everything to get state back up and running.

[Slabasaurus]

Sorry Eric but I did not state "last govt shutdown" in that comment you are referring to because it was not meant to, juzt referring to budget balancing acts by others. But since you mentioned it, yez Dayton was gov during last govt shutdown and dont forget he waz also the one that stopped it feeling bad bout all the great folks that were out of work ( once again because of zellers & co inability to negotiate, remember was,all about tea party back then, my way or highway) and gov Dayton conceded on most everything to get state back up and running.

to be fair to everyone involved in the shut-down, neither the governor nor the state legislature can take credit for really ending it.

They ended it because they needed to save their job/skins after the beer dried up...

[Eric Wettschreck]

After the beer dried up. Dude, that was good. 10 points to you.

[amateurfishing]

to be fair to everyone involved in the shut-down, neither the governor nor the state legislature can take credit for really ending it.

???!!! Absolutely wrong, if Dayton did not give in it would still be going on, or at least til next election cycle back then.

[Getanet]

Wife- Gov, how you doin?

Gov- Onljfdlkd lkkjdfflks aojd. Aomajkd oafd akld.

Wife- Are you looking forward to coming to Worthington?

Gov- Alkdsfj kdfa akldf adkl wiown afksdj and somethin I think was Japanise.

Wife- You have roots in Worthington, don't you?

Gov- Akljdf ajldsfa ioeur iaiofu Something Swedish adlkfjsl afsdklj afjkldf.

Things went down hill from there.

That's some Gotchya Journalism right there. How was he supposed to be prepared to answers those questions? No wonder Jessie called them jackals.

[smnduck]

Just remember how bad a well spoken Republican was at running the state just a few years ago.

I'll take Dayton any day.

[LMITOUT]

AF, we know you're rather fond of Dayton and the Dem party, but Minnesota's last government shutdown was in 2011. Mark Dayton was governer not T-Paw.

Carry on.

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story...and we know that AmateurCommie is chock FULL of stories today it appears.

[LMITOUT]

Just remember how bad a well spoken Republican was at running the state just a few years ago.

I'll take Dayton any day.

Preposterous statement of the year winner!

[LMITOUT]

Last legislative session:

90 million on the s.l.o.b.

11.4 million to fill pot holes.

priorities ??

Or pizz poor management of our tax revenue.

Not only poor management, but against the law. This SLOB, by law, should have been funded by bonding. However, the Demorats knew they didn't have the votes required to pass the bonding bill if this was included so in the dark of night they slipped it into the omnibus tax bill where only a simple majority is needed.

The moron we have for a governor signed the bill but then later when pressed on it threw up his hands and slurred something that he had no idea it was tucked in the tax bill.

Zero accountability.

Zero leadership.

[LMITOUT]

Dayton raised the issue at the beginning of the debate when he was asked to name three top priorities if he's re-elected. One he mentioned was an increase in taxes on gasoline. However, he was unclear what kind of tax it would be, calling it a "sales tax on gasoline that will raise close to the $6.5 billion that we're short for transportation funding over the next...10 years."

Note that it's a "sales tax on gasoline" which is substantially different than a gas tax, as revenues from a gas tax are constitutionally mandated to go directly to road projects.

The sales tax on gasoline which Dayton is proposing would mean revenues are put into the General Fund and would likely be siphoned off by Dayton and the DFL to build choo-choo trains, payoff Unions, and other dumpster fire projects that are uber-low on the priority scale of rebuilding the state after the last four years of Dayton's Disaster.

[amateurfishing]

The sales tax on gasoline which Dayton is proposing would mean revenues are put into the General Fund and would likely be siphoned off by Dayton and the DFL to build choo-choo trains, payoff Unions, and other dumpster fire projects

I can agree up to this point, if fixind railroad congestion and getting energy materials to market (corn, oil, etc) what is a high priority to you.

As far as the past 4 years, may not be great to some but MUCH better than previous 12!

[aanderud]

Not only poor management, but against the law. This SLOB, by law, should have been funded by bonding. However, the Demorats knew they didn't have the votes required to pass the bonding bill if this was included so in the dark of night they slipped it into the omnibus tax bill where only a simple majority is needed.

Zero accountability.

Zero leadership.

Not only that but they have about the most extravagant property around, even after 'scaling' it back. Their 154000 square foot building is supposed to cost $76 million (They took the $14 million parking ramp out for now at least). Figure interest on bonds to pay for it will run around 3% annually (2.28 million) and then figure in a 20 year depreciation schedule on it (3.8 million per year), and you're looking at annual capital costs of roughly $6 million (not to mention operating costs or anything like that). All that for 154k square feet. This is roughly $39 per square foot.

Meanwhile, rental rates for office space in St. Paul average $13.94 per foot.

I guess these guys have to spend 3x the city average for some reason.

[delcecchi]

Wait a minute. Don't they already charge sales tax on gasoline? It got rolled into the pump price. (pause for google)

Apparently not. But Dayton changed his mind/clarified his position.

Quote:

ST. PAUL, Minn. (AP) — Gov. Mark Dayton on Thursday clarified his call for new gasoline taxes to fund transportation projects.

During Wednesday’s gubernatorial debate in Moorhead, Dayton said he’d propose adding “a sales tax on gasoline” if elected to a second term. Dayton told reporters Thursday he should have been clearer that he isn’t seeking to boost the per-gallon tax assessed at the pump, but rather a tax at the wholesale level.

The governor acknowledged such a tax increase would likely get passed down to consumers, and said he’s open to other proposals. But the first-term Democrat said Minnesotans need to choose whether they will pay for much-needed infrastructure repairs. If not, neglected roads and bridges will continue to deteriorate, he said.

He wants to raise the gas tax. "why not just come out one time and scream it"

PS check out the list of members of "move mn" the "coalition" that is pushing this, also "transit for liveable communities" another advocate.

Here is real story from Pioneer Press

http://www.twincities.com/politics/ci_25...es-tax-increase

from Movemn.org/about

Partners

Meyer Borgman Johnson

Minneapolis Bicycle Coalition

Minneapolis Urban League

Minnesota AFL-CIO

Minnesota Asphalt Pavement Association

Minnesota Association of Townships

Minnesota Cancer Alliance

Minnesota Center for Environmental Advocacy

Minnesota Community Foundation

Minnesota Consortium for Citizens with Disabilities

Minnesota County Engineers Association

Minnesota Environmental Partnership

Minnesota Farmers Union

Minnesota Government Engineering Council

Minnesota Housing Partnership

Minnesota Inter-County Association (MICA)

Minnesota Public Health Association

Minnesota Public Interest Research Group

Minnesota Public Transit Association (MPTA)

Minnesota Rural Counties Caucus

Minnesota State Building Trades

Minnesota Transportation Alliance

Minnesota Utility Contractors Association

Minnesota Young Professionals Environmental Group

Minnesota Youth Environmental Network

Minnesotans for Healthy Kids Coalition

MN Best, Inc.

Myles Lorentz, Inc.

National MS Society Upper Midwest Chapter

Native American Community Development Institute

Neighborhood Development Center

New American Academy

Nice Ride MN

North Central Bus Sales

North Central States Regional Council of Carpenters

Northstar Corridor Development Authority

North Metro Mayors Association

OPEIU Local 12

Parsons Brinckerhoff

PCiRoads, LLC

Portland Cement Association

Project for Pride in Living

Public Works for Public Good

Quality Bicycle Products

R & G Construction

Rani Engineering Inc.

Regional Health Equity Council, Region V

River Valley Action

Rochester Sand and Gravel

SEH, Inc.

SEIU Healthcare Minnesota

SEIU Minnesota State Council

Self Advocates Minnesota

Sheet Metal Workers Local Union #10

Sierra Club North Star Chapter

Small Business Minnesota

Southeast Minnesota Area Labor Council

SRF Consulting Group

Stantec Consulting

St. Cloud Area Planning Organization

St. Paul Bicycle Coalition

St. Paul Building & Construction Trades Council

St. Paul Riverfront Corporation

Suburban Transit Association

Summit Academy

Teamsters Joint Council 32

Tiller Corporation

TKDA

Toole Design Group

Transit for Livable Communities

Trillum Services, Inc

The Trust for Public Land

Twin Cities LISC

UFCW Local 1189

U.S. Highway 14 Partnership

United Transportation Union

Urban Land Institute Minnesota

Urban Land Institute Minnesota Young Leaders Group

Walker Engineering, Inc.

Wenck Associates

Wendel Companies

Western Minnesota-Red River Valley Area Labor Council

Widseth Smith Nolting

WSB & Associates

Young Professionals in Transportation - Minneapolis Chapter

AARP Minnesota

The Ackerberg Group

Advocating Change Together (ACT)

Aeon

African American Leadership Forum

African Career, Education & Resource, Inc. (ACER)

AFSCME Minnesota Council 5

Aggregate Industries

Alliance for Metropolitan Stability

Alliance for Sustainability

Amalgamated Transit Union Local 1005

American Council of Engineering Companies

American Engineering Testing, Inc.

American Cancer Society Cancer Action Network-Minnesota

American Heart Association Minnesota Chapter

American Institute of Architects Minnesota

American Society of Civil Engineers Minnesota Section

Arc Greater Twin Cities

Architectural Alliance + 20 Below

ARISE

Asian Economic Development Association

Associated General Contractors of Minnesota

Association of Minnesota Counties

Aurora/St. Anthony Neighborhood Development Corporation

Avenue Design Partners

Barr Engineering Co.

Bearence Management

Bicycle Alliance of Minnesota

Bituminous Roadways, Inc.

Bloomington Bicycle Alliance

Blue Cross Blue Shield of Minnesota

BlueGreen Alliance

Bolton & Menk

Braun Intertec Corporation

Catholic Charities of St. Paul and Minneapolis

car2go Minneapolis

Cemstone Products Co.

CentraCare Health

Central Corridor Funders Collaborative

Central Specialties, Inc.

City Employees' Union Local #363

Coalition of Greater Minnesota Cities

Communications Workers of America MN State Council

Concrete Paving Association of Minnesota

Conservation Minnesota

The Cornerstone Group

Counties Transit Improvement Board

Cretex Concrete Products, Inc.

Cycles for Change

Fresh Energy

Geyer Signal of St. Cloud, Inc.

Greater MN Advisory Panel

Growth & Justice

Hardrives, Inc.

Hasslen Construction Company, Inc.

HDR Engineering, Inc.

Highway 169 North Task Force

Highway 55 Corridor Coalition

Highway 23 Task Force

HNTB

Hope Community Inc.

Housing Preservation Project

HR Green

I-494 Corridor Commission

IBEW Local 292

International Union of Operating Engineers Local 49

Intex Corporation

ISAIAH

Jewish Community Action

Kimley-Horn and Associates, Inc.

KLJ Engineering

Laborers District Council of MN and ND

Laborers Employers Cooperation and Education Trust

Laborers Local 405

Laborers Local 563

Laborers Local 1091

Laborers Local 1097

Lao Assistance Center

League of Minnesota Cities

LHB, Inc.

Mankato/North Mankato Area Planning Organization

Mathiowetz Construction Company

Metro Cities

Metropolitan Consortium of Community Developers

Metropolitan Economic Development Association

[amateurfishing]

Nothing but a bunch of unions attempting to strong arm the govt to line theid own pockets. If they want $$$ for light rail they can go find it in d.c.

[LMITOUT]

I can agree up to this point, if fixind railroad congestion and getting energy materials to market (corn, oil, etc) what is a high priority to you.

Fixing railroad congestion can be accomplished by allowing pipelines to be built across the state instead of slow walking the process until after the election when he'll then deny the permits like the coward he is. Ditto for PolyMet.

BTW, those weren't the choo-choo trains I was talking about. I was referring to light rail which is a complete money pit that is losing money. By using a sales tax on gas instead of increasing the gas tax he'll be able to divert funds from rural road projects to bail out the failed light rail social engineering project in the metro.

[amateurfishing]

FYI...the success or failure of light rail cannot be determined in a day, a term, or even a decade. This is infrastructure that takes years to build and just as many to get right, get ridership up, and operate propetly and effeciently. Chicagos Cta was not perfect and continues to evolve today. Baltimores tunnell took 3 times longer than planned to build and billio s over budget but was still deemed necessary for infrastrucure and relieving congestion. No way as something as big as building light rail system from scratch will you see roi within 10 years, not possible. But if u wanna see $5/gal/gas then keep complaining.

[LMITOUT]

Yeah...because No LR=$5 gas.

Funny that gas isn't $5 then because nobody is riding the LR. LOL.

Good grief. Drink a little more progressive pipedream Kool-Aid.

[delcecchi]

The blue line cost 715 Million dollars. Based on the data on the web site it appears to be breaking even on expenses vrs fares. Total ridership has been 90 million so far.

So, that amounts to about 10 dollars per ride(including interest) so far. As more rides happen the per ride cost will go down, the final value depending on the long term upkeep needs.