Posting Land/Handling Trespassers and Neighbors

[laker1]

If your old enough,you can remember when they made trespass laws the way they stand now. Much deliberation went on between Mn legislatures-DNR and agriculture farmers and land owners up north. Also hunters that hunt up north had input.

It was one of the most deliberate thought out processes I remember and it is working.

[MJ1657]

It blows my mind to read that there are people that would go onto other peoples property without permission.

[delcecchi]

It blows my mind to read that there are people that would go onto other peoples property without permission. [/]

If you are so anal about someone going on your property, please do us all a favor by letting us know by putting up some signs. If you can't be bothered, then it must not be a BFD.

[harvey lee]

I think Minnesota should follow states like Missouri, Maine, Texas etc that allow a land owner to paint a post purple. Some states allow orange paint. This would make it a bit harder for those that tear down signs and trespass. This posting of signs every so many feet is a high maintenance issue and is subject to vandals.

After the election, I will be talking to my representative about this. I am sure it has been discussed in the past but I will bring this up again.

This state will never go for the painting of the post idea.

MN wants it to be as easy as possible for everyone to access anyone's land no matter the cost to the landowner. They say let the landowner pay the fee or cost and spend their time doing the postings. That's the easy way out for the state.

Then there are those who simply will walk right past a NT sign or those who believe if it is not posted that they are welcome to come on in anyways. How anyone can think like that is beyond me, I guess they were brought up not respecting other peoples property, or they would ask.

Oh ya, the landowner lives a bit farther a distance than I want to drive to ask permission so lets go in anyways and if caught, we will say we could not locate the landowner.

In regards to accessing someone's land that you could not contact, no, no one is entitled to access. Maybe in ones mind they may but again, lack of common sense or respect.

No respect at all, period.

[brittman]

There is a big difference between accessing land that is not posted and choosing to trespass on legally posted land or unposted Ag land in MN. Some on here seem to want to tie the two together.

Let's look at the flip side of landowners posting "a little outside their boundaries" or placing posters or locks on gates on roads that provide access into public land. I have called the DNR onto both and aggressively pursued the issues with the COs management.

[MJ1657]

[motley man]

Post it so nobody can question it ! If you put signs on trees, put them over 8 foot up so they can't tear them down ! Posting is the easy and best way to solve the problem.

[motley man]

No need to get nasty on here about this people !

[delcecchi]

Do you post signs around your yard? Maybe someone should set a deer stand or camper or maybe run around your yard with ATVs and see how much you would like it. Not cool to use things other people paid for without permission.

We have close to 900 acres not all connected. Can you imagine the time and money it would take to post all of it?

Maybe we should have to hang a sign on our car or house we own so somebody doesn't use it without permission. Stupid

The law says that posting your car or house or yard or ag land is not necessary. You have 900 acres of non-ag land? What does it take to post it? ten signs per mile of border?

Maybe you should take it up with your state legislator if you find the requirement to post your non-ag land so burdensome.

[MJ1657]

Its Ag land. We own it and therefore nobody should be on it without permission. Key word we own it which means we bought and paid for it.

Write the check and you can decide who you want to allow on your property.

The reason that so many people are not allowed to hunt on private property is because so many trespassers ruined it for others.

[CaptainMusky]

The reason that so many people are not allowed to hunt on private property is because so many trespassers ruined it for others.

exactly! This is why I will always and have always asked permission to hunt. I think its completely ludicrous that someone would think they are entitled to hunting something they KNOW isn't theirs or they have permission to. No respect.

[aanderud]

We have close to 900 acres not all connected. Can you imagine the time and money it would take to post all of it?

I can actually imagine the cost. Were the trespassing laws written this way prior to your purchase of those 900 acres? If so, then I guess I don't feel too bad. It's nothing new, and it's not just MN that does it. Consider it an additional tax.

Speaking of taxes. Most of the privately owned forest land up north actually receives tax incentives if people agree not to subdivide it any further, via the sustainable forest incentive plan or SFIP). So, you get a tax break if you enroll in it, which is fine I guess. Just one of the millions of tax breaks out there.

Funny thing is, the state has taken the private access thing ONE step further with this program -- if you have more than 1920 acres enrolled in the SFIP, you CANNOT post your land. You MUST allow public recreation on it. So, they received tens/hundreds of thousands of dollars (or millions in some cases) in tax breaks in return for not posting the land.

Obviously some of the larger forestry companies like Blandin Paper Company, Molpus Woodlands Group, and Potlach are on this list, with hundreds of thousands of acres each. There were 9 such enrollees last year.

So, a challenge to some of y'all who act like this is such a cut and dry easy thing. I challenge you folks to try and get written permission from Blandin, Potlach, and Molpus and the other 6 large landowners who enrolled their >1920 acres in the SFIP program. If you can get written permission from any of the 9, I'll be surprised. If you can get all 9, wow. I'm guessing you can't, and I know for sure that you won't get it in short notice (for instance, same day on a weekend if you decided to leave the city and take in some of the fine lands up north for a change).

Until then, this is just merely ONE example of non-posted privately owned non-agricultural land that is legally available -- not just as an oversight by the legislature, but intentionally, through careful wording of the trespassing regulations. Hunt it, or don't hunt it. Won't hurt me either way. But it is rightfully yours to hunt due (in the SFIP cases at least) to the millions in tax incentives that were given to the owner in trade for implied public access.

I'll never know all of the details of all of the tax incentive programs like SFIP when looking at the plat maps using my smartphone...but I will be able to keep track of the fairly simple rule that un-posted non-agricultural land is available to be hunted on -- preferably with permission, but without permission as a last resort.

I think I'm done with this thread, as I've stated clearly what my stance is. I hope some eyes are opened up to the possibilities of hunting and recreating where they didn't know they existed. The SFIP thing was somewhat of a surprise for me to learn, at least. I probably shouldn't have hijacked this particular thread for my long rant, but it is what it is. Welcome to the internet.

[MJ1657]

Laws are laws and we all know how silly a lot of them are. This has nothing to do with laws its all about common courtesy. Common courtesy tells you that you do not use others peoples property that they paid for as your own.

Where do you draw the line on using others property? If you can hunt on it should you be able to camp on it, build a shack on it, heck maybe cut firewood on it.

Let's see what laws can be dig up on this. I'm interested.

[CaptainMusky]

Aanderud with all due respect I could give two $hits about corporate owned land. I'm concerned about indivually owned parcels by folks like you and me. Do not attempt to lump their land in with those acres owned by the rest of us just to try and price your disrespectful point.

I deplore people who act like you do or feel its their place to "recreate" as they see fit on other's land. Its disrespectful and completely against everything I stand for and how I was brought up. Perhaps there should have been some "switching" done to teach respect for folks around here.

Did you completely ignore my post about the jagoffs I encountered who ended up killing a guy? Guess what? He was right! Dead right! Just remember that. You cross the wrong person some day it could be you. Or you show some respect and politely ask permission when you can or move on if you cannot and you will likely avoid it.

Its sad but its what this world has come to.

Heck some of these old codgers are fun to talk to.

Talked to 3 farmers yesterday asking permission to hunt some land (not posted mind you). They declined but said since I asked I could come back after deer season and have at it! Bonus! Prime land for me and my son to hunt just because I asked.

[smsmith]

Aanderud...simple question: do you own recreational land?

[CaptainMusky]

If we want to go by the rule of the land and laws on the books then a group of 4 or more native americans together off the reservation is considered a "war party". Do we honestly need to go there? SMH

[aanderud]

Aanderud with all due respect I could give two $hits about corporate owned land. I'm concerned about indivually owned parcels by folks like you and me. Do not attempt to lump their land in with those acres owned by the rest of us just to try and price your disrespectful point.

I deplore people who act like you do or feel its their place to "recreate" as they see fit on other's land. Its disrespectful and completely against everything I stand for and how I was brought up. Perhaps there should have been some "switching" done to teach respect for folks around here.

Did you completely ignore my post about the jagoffs I encountered who ended up killing a guy? Guess what? He was right! Dead right! Just remember that. You cross the wrong person some day it could be you. Or you show some respect and politely ask permission when you can or move on if you cannot and you will likely avoid it.

Its sad but its what this world has come to.

Heck some of these old codgers are fun to talk to.

Talked to 3 farmers yesterday asking permission to hunt some land (not posted mind you). They declined but said since I asked I could come back after deer season and have at it! Bonus! Prime land for me and my son to hunt just because I asked.

LOL. You're a piece of work Captain. Switching? LOL. I never said I was going to hunt on grandpa joe's land without permission. From my very first post I mentioned TRUSTS, CORPORATIONS, etc. as to why I supported the law as it currently reads. I was counter-pointing with someone who said they couldn't see why the law would be written that way, and I simply stated that as an obvious reason. If you can't read, I can't help you. No sense in arguing any more.

[CaptainMusky]

I can read just fine thank you. If you were only concerned about corporations then why have you wasted so much time here? 90% of the people AND THE OP was talking about personally owned private land?

I guess you have some comprehending to do. Carry on pal. What a piece of work is right. Lmao

[CaptainMusky]

Not sure what the point of this sentence is. Why would you ra NOT post it? If you wanted to keep neighbors or their pets or kids off your yard, I assume you'd ask the neighbors not to go on the yard. Similarly, if you want folks to stay off of your land, you need to tell them that. Folks in this state have a legal right to hunt non-agricultural land until they're told to leave. You can either tell them in person or via signage, which is what legally posting the land accomplishes. Without signage, at least some percentage of folks are going to assume it's open to hunters and won't be courteous enough to ask, especially if you don't live near there.

Simple solution is the one you are trying to avoid for some reason. Just post the land and talk to the people who are currently using it (especially the neighbors, at least one of whom seems to be in effect guiding folks into that land to hunt and probably has been for 10 years).

here is your first post. Mentions NOTHING of corporations. NEXT

[smsmith]

Aanderud...simple question: do you own recreational land?

Answer please.......

[aanderud]

here is your first post. Mentions NOTHING of corporations. NEXT

[smsmith]

Aanderud...simple question: do you own recreational land?

Answer please

[CaptainMusky]

Oh, so it wasn't since "your very first post" in this thread then? Was it the 2nd? 12th? Or which is it? I can surely point it out for you if I have to oh wise one.

Some things never change.

[smsmith]

Answer please

Hello??????

[delcecchi]

Its Ag land. We own it and therefore nobody should be on it without permission. Key word we own it which means we bought and paid for it.

Write the check and you can decide who you want to allow on your property.

The reason that so many people are not allowed to hunt on private property is because so many trespassers ruined it for others.

Right. It is ag land, being used for ag. Therefore people are not allowed on it except for certain special circumstances, even if not posted.

What more do you want the government to do?

[BobT]

Asking for access is only common sense --

I agree but I usually try to take it a step further and say that asking for permission is respectful and courteous even though not required.

[BobT]

I think something is being overlooked. In most of the discussion so far with regard to using unposted land it seems people have some idea that the boundaries are well marked and easy to see. In ag land this is often the case. One can quite easily tell in most cases where a boundary is because it is separated by a fence row or line of trees or something. Where I deer hunt there is absolutely no way short of carrying surveying equipment along that one can tell where one property ends and another begins and a lot of the land is public land (federal or state). If I own a property in northern MN where I deer hunt and want to keep others off, I need to somehow mark said property so they know where the border is. Placing signs appropriately along that border is about the only way to do it with minimal cost.

[deerminator]

It's the hunter's responsibility to know the land they are entering. If it's private and there are no special concessions with the government for the public to hunt it, you ask permission, period. Even if its not posted. That's just common sense. But if you're a landowner and you know people are going to be "tools" about it, you need to post it too so they keep out. Just the way it is unfortunately. Otherwise, they make up stories about how they didn't know. Geez, I ask permission to hunt my neighbor's land each and every year beforehand because I know its the right thing to do. Why is that so hard?

[smsmith]

Anybody know what the law says about somebody who enters unposted, non-ag land, without permission, and gets hurt on that land? Can the owner be sued? What if a chunk of ground hasn't been hunted for years and years and has old rickety wood stands still hanging in trees..."trespasser" climbs into stand and breaks his neck. Can the owner be sued? If the law protects the owner...then okay...go ahead and trespass. If it doesn't, then it is one screwed up statute that requires owners to post their land. If an owner doesn't care that the land gets hunted/trespassed on and doesn't post it because of that...but then can be sued...its pretty much total B.$. IMHO

[NWKR]

Anybody know what the law says about somebody who enters unposted, non-ag land, without permission, and gets hurt on that land? Can the owner be sued? What if a chunk of ground hasn't been hunted for years and years and has old rickety wood stands still hanging in trees..."trespasser" climbs into stand and breaks his neck. Can the owner be sued? If the law protects the owner...then okay...go ahead and trespass. If it doesn't, then it is one screwed up statute that requires owners to post their land. If an owner doesn't care that the land gets hunted/trespassed on and doesn't post it because of that...but then can be sued...its pretty much total B.$. IMHO