2013-2014 Winter Severity Index

[harvey lee]

The deer will have a tough go of it the remainder of the winter no matter what thier numbers say.

Buddy of mine has now cleaned all the snow off his yard and started his feeding and drove through he wood's on the trails and blew the trails open for the deer. he said the deer's stomach is starting to drag on the snow as it is getting so deep in the woods.

We will have some loss this spring and I am sure some doe's will get stressed and abort thier fawns.

[certified jumbo]

We got 12 inches in east central mn. Now the return of the polar vortex with no temps higher than 15 degrees for ten days, wow!!

Lots of bucks only zones for northern half of mn next year,imo.....

[MahtowaDave]

These are the storms that knock out deer. Try walking through that stuff. I hate to say it, but Its over johnny! DNR should not give out one doe permit in the state of Mn. this year, period.

[mntatonka]

These are the storms that knock out deer. Try walking through that stuff. I hate to say it, but Its over johnny! DNR should not give out one doe permit in the state of Mn. this year, period.

You apparently haven't been to 346 or 349. We will still be managed, and should have been intensive last year.

[smsmith]

These are the storms that knock out deer. Try walking through that stuff. I hate to say it, but Its over johnny! DNR should not give out one doe permit in the state of Mn. this year, period.

Outside of a few zone 3 units and perhaps 2 or 3 zone 2 units...I'd agree completely.

[minky]

I would be OK with bucks only.

I wonder how many people would take the first buck they see if there are no doe permits?

[MahtowaDave]

When I say that Mn. should not give out one doe permit in the state of Mn., I WAS considering 346 and 349 into that equation. I am hopeful that the excess deer there are fruitful and multiply and hopefully a few filter north from that area! I realize that there are some areas with does and plenty of them, I would like to see that trend expanded.

[Odonata]

The next few seasons are going to be tough, even with feeding efforts throughout the state. Between the cold, predators, and snow depths than can bury you, the deer are going to have a rough winter. We still have months of cold and more snow. I'd go for bucks only; in some zones the DNR should take a serious look at a buck lottery if numbers drop too low. I'm sure that will raise some 'brows!

[minky]

I would hate to go a whole year and not be able to go deer hunting.

Maybe a shorter season could be the answer if the deer pop drops to low.

[lakevet]

DNR has a proven model of doe permits/bucks only (any buck) that will result in rebound in population relatively soon while still retaining hunters/license sales.

Implementing APR's in the face of a low hunter opportunity situation has too much potential to drop license sales. This is also why a buck lottery is unlikely.

Also, just like pheasants, deer do not pair up for life. Any buck can bred multiple does. Thus the buck population can get harvested at a higher than usual rate with minimal impact on deer population recovery.

Don't panic boys, this is just another winter and there will be deer to hunt this fall.

For those who like big racks, articles by Ranta in Ontario support that a rebounding deer population tends to have more large racked bucks due to the lower stress of less competition/lower stress rut that comes with a lower density deer population.

Lastly, this weather must be pressuring the wolf population some.

lakevet

[slimngrizzly]

All the deer I been watching are looking fat and happy! Im sure theyre as sick of winter as we are but I think theyre doing fine anyways. Im sure "up-nort" is a different story!

Remember what doesn't kill them makes them stronger!! Or doesn't it work that way on deer??

[MahtowaDave]

Slimngrizzly,

You make salient points here. I am also seeing a group of 6 deer in the neighborhood getting around together, looking healthy enough, and moving at times that make sense to conserve energy and still getting to food. That is very encouraging. My understanding is that there metabolism is quite low at this time of year anyway, so that is good also. In April, there metabolism goes crazy and it is at that time that they must have access to food and lots of it. We have time yet before that critical period of time hits. It is so tough to get consistently warm temps with a snowpack like this, so therein lies the anxiety for me. We are all so passionate about hunting as well as simultaneously invested the health of the deer herd that it is hard not to get bummed by what we see in the extended forecast (for the weather and the deer herd). My fingers are crossed and thanks for settling me down on the subject. I'll put the panic button aside for now for the local herd. I also agree that the up north deer situation is a different story altogether. My husky was forced to follow behind me in the snow on our walks this week. That never happens! Usually she pulls me through it! Hopefully the wolves up north are having similar troubles getting around.

[zepman]

March will be the key...let's all hope for an early Spring. We don't need a copy of last year for certain.

[SmellEsox]

No warm-up in sight until mid-March. Hate to bring that cheery news to you all. It may be fishing opener for ice-out again this year.

[Musky Buck]

I remember Halloween, it's been pretty chilly since then, March, the make or break month in a way, have said this many times not but nearly thankful for our low deer numbers, leaves the maximum amount of browse for what's out there, just hope the does can have fawns and not drop them due to their stress. East Central MN is simply buried and if we can't thaw it down some what will a major dumping do to things in March. Bucks only here it comes.

[MahtowaDave]

Yeah, Its bucks only guys and gals. I am similarly thankful that for the most part, the remaining deer herd won't have to compete much for the browse that is available to them. I had that one on my mind as a positive too but Muskybuck got it in print before me. We will find out how hardy the turkeys are this year too. Last years B season was an adventure with the snow. I thought it was a novelty at the time, but the way things look around here, maybe that will be par for the course going forward. This year I will pull down on a D tag and enjoy the novelty of GRASS! Another spin is that this winters conditions couldn't be better for wintering grouse.....I know, low cycle time, but I'm grabbing at anything right now. Less meat on a grouse than a turkey though! O.K., I digress, this is about deer and bear here.....One more positive...Bears are sleeping well and my son has a tag in the bag this fall.

[nonteepical]

Instead of bucks ony just make the decision not to shoot any deer this year in some areas.

[minky]

For some bucks only works while others will chose not to shoot a deer or hunt at all.

For me I enjoy deer hunting so much I will hunt as long as there is a season.

Let's hope for an early spring!

[tfran123]

I will say deer are a lot tougher than you think and I don't think the cold has a major impact (aside from needing more food). Regardless, I'm in East Central Mn, been running cams and deer appear very healthy, for what it's worth we noticed huge fat content on those deer harvested this fall. Does nature know what's in store? I.e. increased fat content knowing winter would be tough, not sure.

Anyway, next 4 weeks are critical, no snow with some regular seasonal temps would really help . . . not to mention a big warm up!!

[mntatonka]

And in some parts of the state, we will (or should) still be intensive, or at the very least managed. Not a lot of the state, but there's still areas with plenty of deer, so don't oversimplify the populations in the state.

[zepman]

And in some parts of the state, we will (or should) still be intensive, or at the very least managed. Not a lot of the state, but there's still areas with plenty of deer, so don't oversimplify the populations in the state.

+1

[MahtowaDave]

+2

Agreed. Pretty ignorant statement on my part regarding the "no doe permits for the entire state." Just like there are some areas that have some real problems, there are areas filthy with deer too. I guess I'm pretty sore about the intensive harvest history in our state, I feel like it had its place, but that it went on too long and in many areas that just didn't support it numbers-wise and I am afraid that we might make the same mistake in the areas that currently hold good numbers. I feel that that would be a shame. Having said that, I need to think of those whose hunting could be directly affected by my opinions about it. I really don't have an agenda other than protecting what we still have and I want to be proactive about getting my opinion out there rather than quietly going about my business, counting on everything just working out by following what the regulations tell us is O.K.. I need to be more careful about how to express that. Sorry about that guys.

[SmellEsox]

I agree with your original statement MahtowaDave. I think 5 deer limits should always be rare. There are always people who want fewer deer than most people want. I think deer should be managed for a socially acceptable number, but more on the hunter's side than anyone else.

[Jameson]

And in some parts of the state, we will (or should) still be intensive, or at the very least managed. Not a lot of the state, but there's still areas with plenty of deer, so don't oversimplify the populations in the state.

In your experienced opinion which is better and why; Early antlerless season 2 deer limit with regular season Intensive limit of 5 OR Early antlerless season limit 5 with regular season Managed limit of 2?

My non-experienced opinion is that the EA season of 5 is better, because it lets the hunters concentrate on killin does when the hunter's aren't pre-occupied chasing antlers.

Just curious and wondering how the EA season went this year. Wonder if the DNR considered it a success?

[mntatonka]

In your experienced opinion which is better and why; Early antlerless season 2 deer limit with regular season Intensive limit of 5 OR Early antlerless season limit 5 with regular season Managed limit of 2?

My non-experienced opinion is that the EA season of 5 is better, because it lets the hunters concentrate on killin does when the hunter's aren't pre-occupied chasing antlers.

Just curious and wondering how the EA season went this year. Wonder if the DNR considered it a success?

That would depend on your ultimate goal I suppose, and how quickly or drastically you are trying to drop the population. It would also depend on each individual situation regarding how much land is essentially unhunted.

I don't think the early antlerless seasons in the sub-permit areas in 2013 had any effect on the population. The areas they were in were too confined and didn't give many hunters an opportunity to participate. I don't think there were many more than a dozen hunters in the "Zone B" sub-permit area, and our party was 10 of those.

It really doesn't matter when you shoot them, they still can't have antlers. Those who are willing to control the population by shooting multiple does in these high population areas usually aren't too concerned about chasing antlers.

I do know that it seems to be considerably tougher to harvest them in October during the early antlerless season, due to most crops still being in and the majority of the underbrush/foliage still being thick and green (at least in Zone 3 where I deer hunt). Because of that, I would have to say that if you're trying to reduce a population, the best way to do it without using a harvest restriction (EAB, etc.) is to have a 5-deer limit during the firearms seasons, and a 2 or 5 deer limit during the early antlerless.

[Jameson]

...I do know that it seems to be considerably tougher to harvest them in October during the early antlerless season, due to most crops still being in and the majority of the underbrush/foliage still being thick and green (at least in Zone 3 where I deer hunt). Because of that, I would have to say that if you're trying to reduce a population, the best way to do it without using a harvest restriction (EAB, etc.) is to have a 5-deer limit during the firearms seasons, and a 2 or 5 deer limit during the early antlerless.

Thanks for the response.

The EA seasons I've hunted North of the Cities we didn't have much trouble filling our tags in October. Suppose that may change between locations.

It'll likely never happen, but I am in favor of a late doe hunt when necessary. I know, I know....too cold, bucks might have dropped their antlers, blah, blah, blah. Seems like the does would be hitting the food as hard as ever and the foliage surely wouldn't be a problem.

[mntatonka]

Thanks for the response.

The EA seasons I've hunted North of the Cities we didn't have much trouble filling our tags in October. Suppose that may change between locations.

It'll likely never happen, but I am in favor of a late doe hunt when necessary. I know, I know....too cold, bucks might have dropped their antlers, blah, blah, blah. Seems like the does would be hitting the food as hard as ever and the foliage surely wouldn't be a problem.

I'd certainly have no problem with a late doe season. Taking a shed buck or two is a risk you take when you're trying to lower/control a population. A late season could be added if the doe harvest wasn't as high as it should have been during the firearms season. Granted, that would also require a DNR that has a reasonable goal, and is able to get accurate harvest data right away (not 3 months after the seasons like they are now)

[Musky Buck]

lol but should be tranquilizing these excess does and moving them north lol.

[InTheSchool]

March is here. Minus 24 this morning and snow up to the crotch of a tall Swede. High forecast for minus 10 to minus 15. What now?

[certified jumbo]

Not a 30 degree high temperature in next two weeks.....