Wolf Delisting

[InTheNorthwoods]

Didn't see this posted anywhere:

But just read this headline from an online news paper.

"Klobuchar: Minnesota wolves coming off endangered list by end of 2011"

Here is a portion of the article

Quote:

Minnesota's burgeoning population of gray wolves may finally be coming off the federal endangered species list.

Sen. Amy Klobuchar, D-Minn., announced today that the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service has agreed to remove the wolf population in Minnesota, Wisconsin and Michigan by the end of next year.

The decision is the latest chapter in a long legal tug-of war over the wolves' legal status.

[hockeybc69]

For all you guys in the northern areas, thats got to be a huge sigh of relief. I dont envy you at all.

[SledNeck]

For all you guys in the northern areas, thats got to be a huge sigh of relief. I dont envy you at all.

excellent news

[jjjohnson]

This is terrible news(if its true). Parananoia about wolves is a clear signal that the educational system in this state is falling apart.

Oh well.........

[GatorBait]

How is it terrible news...bascially this is just going to allow the state dept's the right to extinguish of that wolf that just ate ur $1,000 cow....Instead now, its the feds and I've heard of one in wisconsin thus far because it threatened human life. If it was stock it was threatening it would have lived. Not like this will knock the pop down, but it'll let the state have more control over the pop rather than the feds. I enjoy seeing wolves from a distance, think they are unique and all, but when it comes to the predatory side of things, we are better off w/o them.

They say it's pretty much a go as they have done their homework to protect against legal action from the anti groups..Who knows...Needs to happen imo though.

[jjjohnson]

right to extinguish of that wolf that just ate ur $1,000 cow....

No sympathy from me. You open a buisness and then whine and cry about the risk. Then you need to find a new line of work. But this isnt what its really about though, is it?

As far as killing the wolf as a way of reducing risk. B.S. Poeple shouldnt be able to [PoorWordUsage] all over our ecosystem so they can pay their mortgage. I dont care about your mortgage. And my guess is you dont care about mine.

I dont mean to pick on you Gator. I dont know you. I am just commenting on that mentality. Im also not some hippie enviro freak. I just really hate uninformed opinions. There is so much information out there based on facts and science, regarding this subject. It just amazes me that people dont educate themselves before taking a stance on this subject. But, whatever......

[hockeybc69]

Give us your factual based opinion then, that there is a need to keep the wolf listed hotshot. Geez.

[mrklean]

hopefully a hunting season is in the future that i would love to see

[BRULEDRIFTER]

I just really hate uninformed opinions. There is so much information out there based on facts and science, regarding this subject. It just amazes me that people dont educate themselves before taking a stance on this subject. But, whatever......

Right back at ya, Big Shooter!

[jjjohnson]

Give us your factual based opinion then, that there is a need to keep the wolf listed hotshot. Geez.

Its not my job to educate the masses of some anonymous internet forum.

Try this wolf

[hockeybc69]

And that teaches us what?

Whats in there that tells us the wolf shouldnt be delisted? Google anything and you will find info from the far left to the far right on any subject.

Facts shmackts.

Time for the ole wolf to have a predator above it.

[jeffreyd]

contact your senators and tell them to co sponsor s3919. it is time the fws give the management back to the states and the people that can control the refuge areas that the wolves were intended to be in. no one is going to tell me that management is good when the citizens are told that only 100 wolves will be in a recovery area and that area now has over 700. how is that good management on anyone's part? It is time that the greenies dont get their way again. Peta is trying to buy off the state of kansas to put up a no fishing sign, they have sent their letter out about how delisting the wolves is bad, and the same old rhetoric. time for sportsmen and women take back their sports and management of wildlife.

[jjjohnson]

hopefully a hunting season is in the future that i would love to see

Thank you mrklean.

This is what its about. Dont hide behind B.S. like "it eats my cows" or "it eats my dog" or "theres to many" or "it eats my kids" or "I cant find any deer" wha wha wha

Shooting a wolf for sport wolf is a blast. Ive done it and it can be quite the hunt. I just cant stand it when people make up "schmacts" about the wolfs role, or detriment, to an ecosystem. And, no I wont provide you with facts figure it out for yourself.

They also shouldnt be hunted in the lower 48. But, again, whatever........

[BRULEDRIFTER]

I just don't see a benefit to keeping them listed. Their populations are at least double what the ESA requires so why not put that money and effort on a different species that actually needs to be protected?

It's been stated over and over again, and required in their de-listing, that before any hunting season can be established they need to have a 5yr study period to make sure their populations won't nose dive. Plus, there is a way to put them back on through an "emergency" listing if things got too bad.

Also, consider the animosity their being listed creates. Maybe if they weren't protected there would be a lot less of the 'S.S.S' type killings just to spite the ESA, Gubmint, wolf-huggers, etc. If folks that actually live and work in wolf country (unlike yourself, jjjohnson) saw a financial gain to the local economy from their presence, maybe this animosity would subside a bit.

I have zero interest in hunting one, but I would it would be nice to be able to defend my dog if need be and not be a federal criminal in doing so. I would also like to see less wolves suffering from mange because they're over-populated in certain areas up here. I would also like to see them not stretch their range to far out of where they truly belong and not wind up on the outskirts of suburban areas where they can really start doing things that will, well, cause a howl.

And one more thing I would love to see is a lot more momma moose walking around with a calf or two in the summer. I know that the recently warmer climate, excess deer population (brainworm/over-competition for food) play a role in the moose's decline, but so does a very robust wolf population taking out calving moose.

I say let the state take control, for the good of the majestic, wonderful gray wolf!

[kelly-p]

This is terrible news(if its true). Parananoia about wolves is a clear signal that the educational system in this state is falling apart.

Oh well.........

Wow! I’ve lived in wolf country my whole life. As did my father. As did my grandfather. I think we are educated about Timber wolves. There is something very scary going on with Timber wolves the last 5 or so years. That is that they are losing their fear of humans. We are all in uncharted territory with this as Timber wolves have never before gone so many generations not viewing humans as a threat. This past spring one of my neighbors had trouble with wolves killing his calves so each night he brought the calves into the barn. The wolves came into the barn and killed the calves. Then a few weeks later they came onto the deck of his house and killed his wife’s cat. ON THE PORCH OF HIS HOUSE! This spring as I was working on our farm equipment the wolves came out of the woods and went after my dog backing him against the grain drill. While I was there! The wolves did not even back off as I ran at them throwing wrenches at them. No we are in scary times concerning wolves and it is not “paranoia”. The education system does have a problem as it now teaches that Mother Nature is the fawn playing with the wolf pup in a field of spring flowers on a bight sunny day rather then teaching reality. Reality is that Mother Nature is cruel and unforgiving and the strong kill the weak. Do not say that it is because we live in wolf country. The historical range of the gray wolf was all of the US except Hawaii so where ever you live wolves should be there also. Why can't we have a few packs of wolves in Edina?

[kelly-p]

Its not my job to educate the masses of some anonymous internet forum.

Try this wolf

[Todd Caswell]

They also shouldnt be hunted in the lower 48. But, again, whatever

Why not? And no I'm not going to do the research on my own, post your own reasons.....

[hockeybc69]

We are dealing with an internet [PoorWordUsage] on this one guys.....

[Todd Caswell]

I'm with you kelly I know people that have seen the same behavior as you in the past few years, tried throwing stuff and yelling as well the first time along with calling the FEDS ( you know where that went) second time they threw LEAD, that took care of it. Shoot , bury, shut up..

I like wolves, I like seeing them, but if I feal threatened, or one of my pets or family is threatened and I'm armed it's going to get shot whether it's protected or not. Do I want a wolf season or would I buy a wolf tag heck no, but everyone should have the right to protect themselves, family, pets or livestock. Lets face it we (humans) are at the top of the food chain there not..

[Surface Tension]

The wolf coming off the endangered list should have been looked at as a success story.

Instead there are those that fought to keep it there. Why is that? I would say that group of thought is nothing more then paranoia and uneducated as far as wolves. Granted there some that are in favor of the de listing that are not too educated in wolves as well. Big difference there is who abused the Endangered Act. Much of the problem encounters with wolves close to humans would have been avoided if that abuse hadn't occurred. If anything it backfired and there are more citizens that feel that wolves need to be thinned because of the problem encounters that are on the increase.

Thing is you don't have to be an expert in wolves. We have the experts in the Fed Gov saying the wolves should come off the list. You have the MN DNR saying wolves should come off the list and be managed by the state.

So far it has been the paranoia and uneducated thinking that has blocked us from doing that.

You might be surprised how many wolves are being killed every year by the Fed government.

We need to be able to manage wolves and allow one to defend ones property and livestock by directly taking out a wolf that has the tendency to show no fear of man and carry out attacks on pets and livestock in his presence. We need to reduce the numbers of wolves back to what the experts say is realistic for MN. When the State can do that under its management it will not be a free for all on wolves.

[just_jig]

To be pessimistic here, the article say's MAY be De listed. Also, why the end of next year? What is wrong with now?? I believe the Wolf has been De listed 3 times already but due to law suits from wacko fringe groups a Federal Judge placed them back on the list. President Bush removed them before he left only to have the Obama administration place them back on.

Clear example of the Federal Govt taking over State rights.

[cbrooks]

It now sounds like the delisting is getting push by a democratic senater Amy Klobuchar. She plans to sponser a bill to require de-listing of the wolves in hopes of blocking future legal challenges.

[ANYFISH2]

I think this is good news.

I doubt you will find a more pro wolf person than myself, i admire these animals. I was fortunate to work with wolves for a year and a half at Camp Ripley as well as study wolve While in college in Ely. I may have been taught some old school thoughts but feel I keep myself pretty informed.

Now this is great as Grey wolves have now expanded to probably the largest exceptable range in Minnesota. Any farther south or west and the habitat is not as suited and the best prey will be livestock, not what any of us want, because that equals dead wolves and dead livestock.

Once the state can finally take over the managment of the Grey wolf, we as a state finally will get a say as to how we want them managed. IMO we will have a hunt some day, but not for quite some time. The state will need to really figure the perfect number of wolves each section of state can fully support, evironmentally and socially. I also doubt that any hunt will be done to really reduce populations much from where they are now.How fast would this go back to court, if the animal rights groups got a hold that there was a noticble drop in the population after a hunt was started.

Wolves shouldn't continue to go unmanaged. They shouldn't be feared as well,(although I have never had a negitive experience like you mentioned Kelly) wolves are going to be apart of the landscape in Minnesota hopefully for ever, we can and will coexsist. Yes they will eat some of our deer, so what that is what they do, there will always be enough deer for us! Wolves will continue to depredate on livestock and pets, it terrible, but it will still happen after delisting. My biggest fear for the wolves is the ablity to "protect" property. My reasoning is this I fear some will take it as it was in the pasture so I shot it, it was looking for the calves(that where in the barn). I make this statment only becuase I have grown up in an agciculture community, many needlessly killed wolves will result if they can just protect thier property.

All in all I think the delisting is the right thing to do, it should have been finished years ago. And anyone whom thinks that a predetor can continue to go unmanaged, while man manages and effects all other populations of animals is just not seeing the big picture or just doesn't understand it.

[ERdeerhunter]

This is what its about. Dont hide behind B.S. like "it eats my cows" or "it eats my dog" or "theres to many" or "it eats my kids" or "I cant find any deer" wha wha wha

Shooting a wolf for sport wolf is a blast. Ive done it and it can be quite the hunt.

So according to your logic based on the "real facts," wolves should NOT be managed for overpopulation, depredation of livestock, increasing encroachment into city limits or a loss of fear for humans, BUT it's okay to kill them just for fun.

I would ask you to explain your reasoning, but I'm sure you'll just tell me to go look it up. Oh well then.....whatever.....

[mrklean]

Man you really twisted what i said to make us all look like hillbilys that like to just kill things. There are a number of reason i would like to see a season on them the main ones are population control, we have all seen how the population has increased from year to year. Money, i really think that opening up a wolf season could bring really good money to the state. Having a draw system like the elk tag and only giving out a small number for population control i think would draw good money.

[CRAZYEYES]

I dont see whats wrong with saying I kill them for fun. Most of us on here kill lots of stuff for fun. We do it in a respectable way and dont waste but we do it for enjoyment. I bet wolf hunting is fun.

[Steve Foss]

As Bruledrifter pointed out, the ESA has accomplished its goal with Upper Midwest wolf populations. It's not the USFWS dragging its feet. The wolf was already de-listed, but the de-listing was blocked by lawsuit(s) filed by animal rights groups.

The de-listing should be allowed to reach completion, for the simple reason that the goals set out for the wolf by listing it under the ESA have been accomplished. Time to move on.

Then all the fine residents of the state of Minnesota, some backed by big dollars from outside groups, some not, can pressure the Minnesota DNR/Legislature. It'll be a ****storm for sure, but at least Big Brother's nose will be out of it, and it'll be our own ****storm.

Now, this is aside from the list/de-list debate, and moves on to what to do about it after the species eventually is back under state control. I had a different opinion 10 years ago, but living in wolf country since then and seeing how emboldened they've become (I could list examples, but their numbers are legion), I believe there should be a limited hunting/trapping season on them, for the simple reason that killing some of them is what it will take to put fear of man back in them.

Think the argument over what to do with the species is a ****storm? Wait until a healthy, habituated/bold wild wolf kills someone in Minnesota. That'll be a ****storm the likes of which hasn't been seen in a long time.

Warier wolves will certainly make my job as a wildlife photographer more of a challenge, but I believe it's worth it. Holding a great love and respect for wolves, which I do, doesn't mean we have to blind ourselves to a balanced look at the issue.

BTW, I doubt opening a limited hunting season on wolves will bring a lot more dollars into the state from visiting hunters. Tag numbers will be fairly low, I'd imagine, and non-residents will only likely get a small portion of them, so it's not going to be anywhere near the economic impact this state receives annually when thousands and thousands of people who want to see or be near wolves come to Minnesota as tourists interested in a non-lethal encounter.

[JBar]

IMO I think this is a great thing. The wolf population in many northern Minnesota area's has greatly improved and I personally think have came to an overpopulation. I also agree with Kelly P. As I grew up close to the same area, these past few years wolves have been getting braver and moving their home ranges closer and closer to people as I've noticed with the deer population the deer have been moving out of their old area's of less population and vastness to next to people and human activity in my thought to keep the predators at bay. If you want to manage the deer population in northern Minnesota you have to manage the main predator of the deer in nortern Minnesota. I also think that as a quote of the wolves are taking livestock. IS NOT, B.S. this is a true statement and if your lively hood was at stake you would want to do something about it. Nobody like's a pay cut. If you could help stop a pay cut would you? I know, I would. This subject has been going round for a long time up here and most I have discussed with all have the same opinion something needs to be done.

[JimmyJames]

Man you really twisted what i said to make us all look like hillbilys that like to just kill things. There are a number of reason i would like to see a season on them the main ones are population control, we have all seen how the population has increased from year to year. Money, i really think that opening up a wolf season could bring really good money to the state. Having a draw system like the elk tag and only giving out a small number for population control i think would draw good money.

I agree, population control is the key. A money maker for the state? , that on the other hand is a joke.

[ac777]

Maybe JJ's A Troll Troll? I'd love to see a hunting season for wolves, and if one was attacking livestock, if I had any, I would want to get rid of it, when they do that they're called a Varmint!