Trading or releasing T-Jack by Friday?

[FISHINGURU]

he was probably looking to the side of the field that had competition with real defenses, had no running game or defense that had his back, took shots downfield to try and win games on a junk team.

it would be a pretty safe bet almost any qb in the league could throw a good td to int ratio if they only threw the balls an average of 3 yards lol...then the one in a million chance they take downfield isn't an issue because not only can't the WRs catch it either can the DBs because its so ugly...i'd love to see what junkson could string together if we had to throw it up and down the field at will.

hey look at me mom...i throw more tds then ints because i have no nads and only throw to the open guy 3 yards downfield even though they played 8 in the box and i really had 2 guys wide open!!! i'm such a game manager but don't expect me to step up when i need to or grow a pair and start slingin....signed junkson!!

[james_walleye]

Exactly. Hey Fishin, 4 times in last couple years Sage brought the texans back from 21 points or more. He threw the ball well against teams that threw he was going to throw the ball. That is something that Jackson can't do. So go ahead, keep throwing out stats Mr. Statboy. Its obvious you can't think for youself without a stat sheet in front of you. Not being able to throw the ball against teams who know your going to run? Or being able to throw the bal against a defense who knows your going to pass? Its not rocket science, but i know you don't get it, because its not on a statsheet. Imagine Sage with the luxury of being able to throw against a defense who thinks he's going to hand the ball off? Again, its not on a statsheet fishin so i don't expect you to be able to answer that....

[AWH]

Would Sage be as "great" if he had Childress to tie one arm behind his back? I guess there's only one way to find out, and that's to have Sage run the show for the Purple. But with Favre here, that debate can keep going on for another year.

I find it funny how people fail to realize and/or admit that many of T-Jacks problems can be put squarely on the shoulders of Brad Childress. Certainly not all of them. But to act like T-Jack is completely at fault in his struggles is laughable. And no mention by those same people that he has only played in 25 games since coming out of Division 2 football.

There's a huge difference in the level of play from major college football to the pros, let alone what he dealt with at Alabama State. Look no further than Heisman trophy winning QBs and how many have failed to make it in the pros. It's a different game. Even at the college level, the best QBs take time to develop. It's a very rare exception when one comes in as a freshman and stars. Are we expecting that to be different at the professional level when the level of competition is exponentially superior?

Aaron

[FISHINGURU]

YAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWNNNNNNS

NEWS FLASH! for you people that come up with all the excuses for junkson with this that and the other thing.

do you realize we run a west coast offense? that means 3 step drop boom get rid of the ball...sometimes its a 5 step drop boom get rid of the ball...its no ones fault but junksons that he can't make quick decisions or read defenses.

you could already see how sage and soon you'll see how favre just drop back and get rid of the ball....you guys think junkson is so great and can keep a play alive when it's his fault from the snap that he can't hit the couple open wr's on a 3 or 5 step drop....even when junkson finally does hit a guy it's already been a few seconds to late.

they said the same thing about vick maybe he couldn't be the passing qb he needed to be because of the west coast offense...maybe its best for junkson and his fans to be in another system lol.

[james_walleye]

Would Sage be as "great" if he had Childress to tie one arm behind his back? I guess there's only one way to find out, and that's to have Sage run the show for the Purple. But with Favre here, that debate can keep going on for another year.

I find it funny how people fail to realize and/or admit that many of T-Jacks problems can be put squarely on the shoulders of Brad Childress. Certainly not all of them. But to act like T-Jack is completely at fault in his struggles is laughable. And no mention by those same people that he has only played in 25 games since coming out of Division 2 football.

There's a huge difference in the level of play from major college football to the pros, let alone what he dealt with at Alabama State. Look no further than Heisman trophy winning QBs and how many have failed to make it in the pros. It's a different game. Even at the college level, the best QBs take time to develop. It's a very rare exception when one comes in as a freshman and stars. Are we expecting that to be different at the professional level when the level of competition is exponentially superior?

Aaron

You ever think the reason Childress calls the plays he does for Jackson is that Jackson can't handle anymore than that?

We arent talking about a 2nd year QB here. There is a big difference between a 2nd year and 4th year QB. Enough excuses, the guy doesnt get it. He can't throw the ball against 8 and 9 man fronts. Hes lucky he hasnt been playing on a team with an average RB and facing 7 man fronts. That would be ugly. A 4th year QB should be showing more than he does, give me a break. Talk to fans of other NFL teams, they are disappointed that Jackson isnt going to be the QB. They think hes a joke and a guarantee for the vikings to go nowhere in the playoffs.

[AWH]

its no ones fault but junksons that he can't make quick decisions or read defenses.

Is it also Jackson's fault that he hasn't been ALLOWED to make decisions or read defenses? As stated earlier, there are former Vikings QBs that have gone on record to state that Childress would rarely allow them to audible. Why are we so quick to blow this off as irrelevant? This means he takes the decision making out of their hands. This is called a recipe for failure. Again, does this mean T-Jack isn't partly to blame? Absolutely not.

I haven't seen any comments on here from people saying that Jackson is a great QB. But I do see some reasonable comments that suggest it's too early to give up on the guy. The backup QB or the guy that isn't seeing the field is always the most popular guy in town unless you have a guy like Tom Brady from 2 years ago at the helm. One bad game and it's time to bench or get rid of the guy. That's simply how fans react. 90% of fans are very quick to judge without looking at or understanding the big picture. The grass is always greener on the other side for them.

For many people right now, T-Jack could go out and throw for 300 yards, 4 TDs and no picks for 6 straight weeks and you'd still want to run the guy out of town. It's beyond the point of being able to accept that maybe the guy has a future in the league.

Aaron

[AWH]

You ever think the reason Childress calls the plays he does for Jackson is that Jackson can't handle anymore than that?

I would say that there's some truth to this, absolutely. But this isn't isolated to Jackson. Childress has been this way with every QB that the Vikings have put out there.

To counteract this question of yours - do you ever think that Childress coaches this way because he's trying to protect his job? When he does this with every QB, don't you have to wonder why? It sure makes it look that way to me. He could take the chance of reaping bigger rewards by allowing his QBs to make decisions. Or he could play it safe (in his mind) and minimize potential mistakes.

In order for a QB to develop, he has to make mistakes. There's no way around it. I have yet to see Childress give T-Jack the opportunity to really show what he can do.

Lastly, Jackson has not had 4 years in the league. This is the start of his 4th year. Meaning he has 3 years of experience, and essentially one year of on the field experience, considering the amount of snaps he has taken. It would be one thing to throw in the towel if he had looked like Gino Toretta all this time. But he has shown steady improvement from day one. Yes, there have been bumps in the road, and some ugly ones. But if you look at his picture of work as a whole (objectively), I beg you to show how he has not continued to improve.

And if there's continued improvement, why should we give up on the guy? Wouldn't it be worth letting him sit on the sidelines for a year to see what he might be able to learn from a guy like Brett Favre? And maybe Childress can even see what happens when he loosens up the reigns a bit.

Bottom line - Favre is the starting QB for 2009. What would the point be to get rid of Jackson right now? How would the Vikings benefit?

Aaron

[james_walleye]

Bottom line...if Favre isnt around, do you want Jackson leading this team? A team with this kind of talent....do you want a guy who at best if a "work in progress" leading this team? There is no way you can say yes....

Someone brought this question up on Sirius NFL radio about Chilly when i was listening and also heard the question brought up on FOX national radio. The guys all said that was bunk and listed sited several situations in the game that had just been played where Jackson was given the chance and failed miserably. So enough of this angle....its a poor excuse. The guy can't read the field, plain and simple. HE DOESNT GET IT. Childress has had nothing but 2nd stringers starting for this team, hes had nothing to work with. You can blame him for that if you want to, neglecting to bring in legit QB's...but enough of the Childress being the problem with Jackson angle, its bunk. Blame Jackson for being the problem with Jackson.

[AWH]

Talk to fans of other NFL teams, they are disappointed that Jackson isnt going to be the QB. They think hes a joke and a guarantee for the vikings to go nowhere in the playoffs.

Why should we care what fans of other teams think? I think I touched on how fans react earlier. I don't look to fans as the voice of reason.

That being said, if the playoffs were starting today, I'm not convinced that Jackson has what it takes today to take us very far either. But we aren't talking about today....I hope!

It's a different sport. But Chauncey Billups didn't have what it took either. Talk to fans about him in his early days. Good thing fans didn't determine his fate and he was given a chance!

Someone mentioned earlier that the T-Jack supporters must just be playing devil's advocate. I am not about to speak for anyone else. But I will say that a very small part of my arguments are in fact being devil's advocate because I don't know what T-Jack's full potential is and there's no way anyone can know this. I just happen to believe in giving people opportunities. And I love it when guy's succeed that the vast majority of people had written off as someone that will never make it. There are a ton of examples of situations like that in sports. However, I fully believe that someone with an objective eye can see the talent and potential of T-Jack. Will he ever reach his potential? Who knows. I just hope he gets the chance.

Aaron

[AWH]

Bottom line...if Favre isnt around, do you want Jackson leading this team? A team with this kind of talent....do you want a guy who at best if a "work in progress" leading this team? There is no way you can say yes....

If it were between Sage and T-Jack? I would want to see what both guys show on the field in pre-season, running the Vikings offense, with both being given the opportunity to run with the first team. I wouldn't rush to judgement about either one because I think running with either one as your starter in 2009 isn't a recipe for getting you to the Super Bowl, which should be the ultimate goal.

If Favre wasn't here and I was forced to make a decision today without giving them both the chance to win the job in pre-season, I would abslutely give the nod to Jackson. I've seen Sage play and I'm not impressed. He has shown flashes. And he has also shown that he should be nothing more than a backup in the league. A good backup at that. I would be happy to have him on my team in that role, no matter who my starter was. But T-Jack has shown steady improvement in his career from day one. If you say otherwise, you're kidding yourself. And with the evidence of his continued improvement, why would we not believe he can continue that trend if he were to start in 2009? There has been no plateau in his career or a decline in his results on the field. The only thing we can logically conclude is an up trend in his performance.

But this entire thread was not about whether he should start or not over Sage. Read the title. It's about whether he should have a spot on the roster or not.

Nowhere in my argument have I said he should be the starter this year. Favre is on the roster. I'd be completely happy if he were the third string behind Sage. My entire point is that it would be a mistake to cut ties with him at this stage. With Favre as the starter, your backup isn't likely to see the field very much. But when Favre is gone next year, do we want Sage and Booty as our top two guys?

Aaron

[AWH]

but enough of the Childress being the problem with Jackson angle, its bunk. Blame Jackson for being the problem with Jackson.

How about both guys accepting responsibility? Neither one is completely to blame, not by a long shot. But both guys play a role.

Aaron

[james_walleye]

I will say at least you bring thoughts from your head instead of from a statsheet and a guy can respect that.

As far as Sage and flashes, thats what i have seen from Jackson. I have seen a couple of the games Sage played in which he brought the texans back from 21 points or more in the 2nd half and he looked nothing short of great. I havent seen anything from Jackson to suggest he can do that. My thoughts are, even if Jackson has been handcuffed, what would Sage do in those same situations. From what i have seen Sage can read the field better and would be better suited to be on the field on your average 3rd and 7. And in the playoffs i'd have more faith in Sage finding that reciever in the 4th quarter on a pressure filled drive because i believe he sees the field better.

Am i saying get rid of Jackson? Ideally no keep them all around. He does have physical talent and if it takes 6 years for him to figure things out then great. I just don't think thats realistic to keep all these guys around. Long term I don't know if the real answer is on this team.

[james_walleye]

With Favre in purple we will know what Childress is about. That question will be answered. I agree with you on that i havent always had alot of faith in Childress.

[AWH]

I agree completely on the Childress comment. We'll know what we have in him as a coach after this season.

I can't disagree with your comments on Sage. If it was playoff time today and I had to put Sage or Jackson on the field to win the game TODAY, I would probably lean towards Sage for several of the reasons you stated. I guess I just look at things differently when talking about players and who is better for the team. Whether we're talking Vikings, Twins, Wild, Timberwolves, I don't always look at what you will get from a guy today. As I tell a friend of mine all the time - BIG PICTURE. Even guys considered to be veterans need time on the field/court in order to improve. When looking at the Sage/T-Jack situation, I just see more upside with Jackson and I believe he has more long term benefits for the team.

But hopefully Favre is the answer this year and either Sage or T-Jack can see the light and clearly stand out as "the guy" to lead the team when it's time.

Aaron

[FISHINGURU]

sooooooo...isn't junkson in the final year of his contract? players look for a payday when they sign their 2nd contract...would you guys be willing to pay him good money to stay here at the end of the season if favre plays a complete season and junkson never even steps on the field?

whats the odds of him even wanting to stay here ? maybe he can go somewhere where he gets to start forsure and make more money!

[LMITOUT]

If he makes a penny over league minimum it would be crime.

Heck, just giving him a roster spot has got to be a misdemeanor if not a felony in some states.

[FISHINGURU]

there won't be many teams looking to sign him, we might be the only team in the NFL that would give this guy a chance for a starting role....seriously what other teams would?

i'd love to see action jackson play for a team that doesn't see 8-9 man fronts most of the time...it wouldn't be fair to him though since it has taken him this many years to almost be able to throw against the same couple formations.

[zamboni]

TJack would look better in a Kansas City Brigade uniform than in ANY NFL uniform.

(EDIT) I just realized the Arena League is more than likely done, but I still stand by my statement above

[PierBridge]

whats the odds of him even wanting to stay here ? maybe he can go somewhere where he gets to start forsure and make more money!

I think a fresh start may be his best option at this point.

Of course he's still here "REAILITY" and I would prefer a young mobile QB over a slow totally un-proven journeymen QB to lead us when it boils down to it.

Of course I won't get my panties in bunch like the usuall suspects ARE over this if it does boil down to Sage versus Jackson being our QuarterBack. I don't see a whole lot of difference in the 2 but then again you guys are the experts and theee know it alls here ...

[FISHINGURU]

start wearing purple for me nowwwwww

[fishin58]

Yaaawwwwwwwwnnnnnn, more jim and fg banter. Guess I will stick to my facts. Right Jim?

[FISHINGURU]

lets see how junkson looks tonight!!! will it be the highschool qb or the ok back up junkson?

[gr8icefishinmind]

WOW........in his first series saqe looked like the for sure #2 qb for the vikes!! haha!! Get real guys.......sage is clearly no better that T-Jack!! Jackson looked good in his 1 and only series tonight! It will be fun to see him play next week......he'll be playing for the #2 spot or for a good trade!!

[LMITOUT]

ROFL! Did anyone just see T-Jack on the bench with his hat on crooked and looking like he missed the short bus again?

One series and yanked? See ya!

[LMITOUT]

[gr8icefishinmind]

Thats the dumbest thing i've ever heard, they had to give poor sage a chance too, and instead of letting him throw the ball they chose to kneel down instead!! haha good one!!

[gr8icefishinmind]

I don't blame him for looking like that, i would be [PoorWordUsage] too if i got yanked for an unworthy 3rd string qb!! but he'll get to play plenty the next game!!!

[LMITOUT]

[gr8icefishinmind]

haha...........you are dillusional!! What did jackson do bad tonight??? lets hear your excuses to why he is a terrible qb!?!?

[LMITOUT]

It's not just tonight, it's his entire body of work you have to look at.

Send him out of town on the next thing smokin'. (No, not Percy Harvin)