TOWER

[chaffmj]

Tom, Haven't seen any moose lately. They like to go by my place in the winter though. Heading up there this weekend will post a report if I see or catch anything.

[Stizo]

Hey everyone!

Read the Timberjay. They put the tower up without conducting the necessary hearings and never obtained a permit.

Unbeleivable.

Stizo

[Cliff Wagenbach]

Hey everyone!

Read the Timberjay. They put the tower up without conducting the necessary hearings and never obtained a permit.

Unbeleivable.

Stizo

Not a very supprising occurance for Greenwood Township!

Cliff

[lkvrmln-NilesBay]

ahhhhhhhhhhhh.

The plot thickens....

[delcecchi]

They went to st louis county. county told greenwood to grant permit. Confusion ensued. Dog ate paperwork. my bad says greenwood twp. In the meantime, tower built. What now?

Stay tuned.

[chaffmj]

Don't get your hopes up or down depending on your view the tower is there to stay.

[Cliff Wagenbach]

I agree!

According to the local newspaper,Greenwood plans to hold a public meeting,(after the fact), to see what the public responce to the tower is.

Cliff

[StillFishin']

Is the tower operational?

I was fishing in Frazier Bay in the Middle of Sept. and didn't get any service. I have Verison so maybe AT&T doesn't share their towers?

StillFishin'

[Silver Scale]

I have At&T and service really increased once the Tower went up so I'd say it's in service.

[PSU]

Me too Silver Scale

[dewey1]

THE TOWER IS OWNED BY AMERICAN TOWER CORP. AT&T WAS THE FIRST ONE ON THE TOWER. THERE WILL BE MORE COLOCATIONS ON THE TOWER. ATC PUTS TOWERS UP TO MAKE MONEY LEASING VERTICAL SPACE. I WOULD IMAGINE T-MOBILE WILL BE THERE SOON. THERE ARE MANY REGS AND PERMITS TO GO THROUGH TO BUILD A TOWER. I CANT SEE IT BEING BUILT "WITHOUT A PERMIT".

[delcecchi]

It was sort of built with a permit. It sounds like that St. Louis county told them to go ahead, but the ball got dropped between St Louis county and Greenwood TWP, so the hearings weren't held and the permit never was actually issued.

At least that is what the story in the Timberjay sounded like.

[shamrock7]

And now the Greenwood Planning director is resigning. Really is too bad. It is a thankless job and John has done an excellent job. Sad to see him move on but can't say that I blame him.

[delcecchi]

That's too bad. It sounds like it was really too big of a job for one guy, probably with no administrative support. Probably not getting paid much either.

Are they punting planning and zoning back to the county?

[shamrock7]

I would hope not but with this board, anything is possible.

[delcecchi]

That would be one way for waters of vermilion to get their 50 dock slots and golf cart parking. :-(

[ponzie]

I wasn't around to attend the meeting so I have a question for those who did attend.

How did the meeting after the fact go?

[shamrock7]

I wasn't there but they approved the tower.

[delcecchi]

From the timberjay....

"....Ziegler’s action put the Planning Commission in an uncomfortable position, one that was only vaguely alluded to at Monday’s hearing that filled the town hall with close to 40 area residents.

Most were grateful for the improved cell phone coverage, but questions were raised on the site selection process and whether or not the tower needed to be so tall. The township also received four written comments on the tower, two in favor and two against.

The tower was built to comply with St. Louis County ordinances, and the Greenwood language on cell phone towers is exactly the same. Peter Beck, an attorney for the tower company, noted that since the tower met the township’s zoning requirements, the Planning Commission did not have much leeway to reject the application.

Representatives from Minnesota Tower were able to answer all the questions raised at the meeting. Beck explanied that the tower was located in a spot that allowed the cell phone provider, in this case AT&T, to fill in coverage gaps and improve signal strength. The tower needed to be at 400 feet to connect to the other towers in the area, such as Gheen and Ely.

“This is line-of-sight technology,” Beck said. Initial scouting for sites identified another potential site on the north side of Vermilion, but that site did not meet the requirements for the radio frequency study.

The tower is located on 80-acres of land owned by Brian Kozar near the intersection of Hwy. 115 and Frazer Bay Road. The site is over a half-mile from the lake. Kozar noted that the township had also approved a conditional use permit for the new Lake Country Power substation that will be located only about a quarter-mile from this cell tower. He said he felt the transmission lines for the new substation will be more unsightly than the cell tower.

Donald Brown, from Breezy Point Road, wondered why the tower was located where it was so visible from such a wide area on the lake. He asked if a series of smaller towers would have been a less obtrusive solution.

Beck said locating a site in the area was difficult because of lakeshore and wetland setback requirements, as well as the need for access to local utilities. It was also noted that locating such towers on state lands was difficult, because it required getting approval from the state legislature.

Beck said the height of the tower is based on topography.

“If your phone is going to work,” he said, “you need to see a tower.”

The flashing lights on the tower are mandated by the FAA.

“Anything over 200 feet must be lit,” Beck said.

Brown said he wasn’t against cell service, he just wasn’t convinced there wasn’t a location that wasn’t so visible.

Several addressed the benefits of finally having reliable cell phone service on Lake Vermilion.

Fred Smith, who operates a barge service, noted he now has service across most of the lake. While the tower is visible out his window, he said it is less obtrusive than his neighbor’s mercury vapor yard lights.

A resident from Niles Bay said the new tower means he can get wireless Internet service. A woman who works for St. Louis County 911-dispatch noted that cell phones, especially with the ability to locate a user through GPS, can save lives.

Steve Lotz asked if other cell providers will be able to locate on the same tower, or if a competitor will be soonbe asking to build their own tower in Greenwood.

Beck noted that county and township ordinances require towers to accomodate multiple users. This specific tower has room for three other providers, which opens up possibilities for other cell providers as well as wireless Internet.

Planning Commission member Walt Moe wondered how the tower would stand up to extreme winds, like the 1999 Fourth of July storm.

Project Manager Gary Huberty said the tower could withstand up to 80 mph. Straight-line winds have taken down cell towers, but in some cases such towers have survived tornado-force winds.

The Planning Commission approved the CUP unanimously. They added three standard conditions that St. Louis County routinely adds to such applications, noting that the tower needs to comply with state and federal, as well as communication tower standards, and must allow use for emergency communications."

[shamrock7]

And a clarification on the resignation. John submitted his resignation effective June 1st 2010. So this is not a direct effect of this but probably didn't help. Anyway, John is retiring. And apparently, there is someone interested in the position that is very knowledgeable in the workings of the office. This person, if hired, is very capable of handling the job and doing it well.

[Stizo]

That's odd! I saw this article in the Timberjay this morning too...but now it's gone!???????????

[delcecchi]

under News click cook/orr and it is still there. must have moved it due to new edition.

[StillFishin']

It looks like if you want good coverage AT&T is the way to go unless other providers rent space on the tower from AT&T.

I have Verizon and get no service at my cabin on the dam end and almost no service when I've tried to use the cell phone out on the lake. I contacted Verizon to see if they will be using the tower.

Anyway, I contacted Verizon asking if they were going to make use of the tower. They say " The information the Research and Development Department has regarding the location of out new towers is proprietary company information that we are unable to disclose to our customers."

I also checked the "coverage area" maps at both AT&T and Verison and sure enough, AT&T shows coverage in my area where Verison has "no service".

Since I won't be back up until next spring I've got time to think what to do. I hate to change as I have a super low fee form Verizon which isn't offered any more, and I get coverage at other areas I have to use the cell phone. I've gotten along with out a cell phone up there in the past but it sure would be nice. I'll keep checking on Verison's coverage area map to see if it changes and make a decision in the spring.

If any one has inside info or finds out other provider have signed on to the tower, please post it.

StillFishin'

[jparrucci]

I received the exact same treatment from Verizon as you did StillFishing! You would think after 8 years of over $100 a month, they could be straight with you. My contract has been up for 3 years, using the same old phone. I am ready to switch at any time, and it sure looks like ATT or Tmbobile will be getting my service (Tmobile works on the same GMS band as AT&T). My brother had full coverage it the Frazer bay area this fall, so I know that is an option as well (just have to figure out if their digital services like internet are working for Tmobile). Like you, I'm giving it till this spring then the switch is on.

[SkunkedAgain]

This is like a flood. Now that one tower is up with one provider, the others won't be far behind. Maybe it takes a year but I'd say to stick with your preferred carrier (or super low deal).

Me...I'm gonna keep telling my boss that my cell doesn't get reception on the lake.

[delcecchi]

I think Tmobile roams on ATT network, or at least it does in cook. I used to have no service north of 169 outside virginia, but then had service from cellular one. Last summer it said ATT as I recall.

I did have to get a phone that does 850 MHz GSM to use the tower in cook. That was several years ago.

[guideman]

I have had verizon for a few years now and it works great on the east end. The west end has been a dead zone for a lot of different phones for years.

I was able to get a signal out on the water in head of the lakes and in Wakemup bay last summer. It wasn't real strong but it did work out away from the shoreline.

"Ace"

[lkvrmln-NilesBay]

I have never had anyone but Verizon...get OK service at my cabin in Niles Bay...but nothing you can count on out on the water...It would be great to have them on the tower...would solve the higher speed internet issues. But, as mentioned about...my office will never know how good it is....

[chucker1101]

I've got Verizon as well, it works well through most of Big Bay and Daisy Bay, but starts crapping out as you get to the middle of the lake. It also doesn't seem to work well on the North side of Pine Island.

What makes me mad is that the Verizon map shows digital coverage through all of the East end and into Trout Lake. I know that the coverage on the East end isn't nearly as good. On Pine Island, the coverage is spotty, but the map shows all of Pine Island, except for a small portion by Moccasin Point, as covered, which is B.S.

Verizon coverage map: http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/CoverageLocatorController

[delcecchi]

I've got Verizon as well, it works well through most of Big Bay and Daisy Bay, but starts crapping out as you get to the middle of the lake. It also doesn't seem to work well on the North side of Pine Island.

What makes me mad is that the Verizon map shows digital coverage through all of the East end and into Trout Lake. I know that the coverage on the East end isn't nearly as good. On Pine Island, the coverage is spotty, but the map shows all of Pine Island, except for a small portion by Moccasin Point, as covered, which is B.S.

Verizon coverage map: http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/CoverageLocatorController

The phone you have can make a difference also. My Nokia seems to work a little better than my wife's Samsung, both on tmobile on the west end (which is actually ATT formerly cellular 1)