What size buck do you shoot???

[shae1986]

I agree Harvey that kids should shoot whatever they please. Get them to enjoy going out and spending time in the outdoors. my dad wanted me to shoot whatever came by and i did my first 4 years and one of them was a small 6 point buck. After that buck i decided to change and in the past 4 years i have shot 1 big buck that is on my wall.

A Shae

[Sutty]

I agree with ya. I don't know if I did a good job of it but I was trying to point out that not everywhere in the state has too many deer and earn a buck or those type of rules can't be state wide. The deer herd needs to managed regionally. I agree with you that the doe options on the all season or muzzleloader could be a problem. It depends on how many people buy those types of licenses.

I hunt on private land on the lake as well. I don't own it, I am hoping in the next few years to buy some land but its not in the cards yet.

[rippinlips]

We take about 6 to 7 does a year on our property by doing that the buck to doe ratio is for evened out thus is why we see more mature bucks during day light hours. What I'm getting at if you have a lot of does which the majority of the state does you will rarely see those mature bucks because they do not have to contend with other bucks for does. Which means just because you don't see the mature bucks does not mean there not there they are there and more then you think you just see the smaller ones more because they have to keep cruising to find does that are not with mature bucks. (It's a proven fact)There are alot more smaller bucks that live through the hunting season then get shot ever year meaning that they will be bigger and smarter next year you will just have to hunt harder for them next year.

[eyepatrol]

Even though we don't get many shooting opportunities at bucks from year to year, last year I know there were at least 8 - 2nd year to 3rd year bucks in the area we hunt that at least made it through the season. Whether or not they made it through winter would be another story I guess. Hopefully they will be around this year, but it does seem as though the bigger ones "disappear" each year. Last year we got 9 deer I believe. 7 does and 2 fawns. Lots and lots of does in the area we hunt.

[slimngrizzly]

Actually, in the farmland of MN, there was a study nearly 10 years ago. They found that nearly 90 percent of bucks harvested were 1 1/2 old or less. I would agree with this 100 percent. Its sad! Unfortunatly, I dont think nearly as many make it as some think? but theres always a few.

As far as what you say about closing the gap in the ratio, creating more daylight activity, very true. Its amazing, there is SO many pluses to a herd managed for quality rather than quantity, most people(including the DNR) have no idea.

[shae1986]

Dont be hard on the MN DNR they are working hard to fix this. Its just hard for them to do without a majority willing to do it. So dont rip the MN DNR. I am tired of people doing this, without them, we wouldn't have a deer herd. They are doing a great job and i hope they find another way to fix the current over population problem that we currently have.

A. Shae

[Mark Christianson]

This is my only post on this topic. Quite entertaining to say the least.

I concur with Shae.

I would much rather have our DNR doing their thing, than having a bunch of us know-it-alls trying to run the show...

They are doing a pretty dang good job. Look at the changes that have been made with zones, limits, licenses, etc.

They are making changes, and soliciting feedback from us know-it-alls.

Keep up the good work Lou and crew! (Lou being our Big Game leader in the DNR)

[DRH1175]

I will shoot just about any legal doe I can. With my bow or rifle. But when it comes to bucks I will shoot only 8 pts or better. I passed on a nice 6 pointer twice while bowhunting last year which I caught a lot of grief from my father in law for. But we still ended up with 3 does and seemed to be enough meat for the freezer. Looking back I am glad I did. We rarely see buck on our land. However I am starting to figure out why? There seems to be about atleast 5 -10 does for every buck I see. Hopefully in the next few years this gets better as we start thining out the herd a bit. We did manage a 12 pointer 3 years ago so I know they exist. There is lots of buck sign but few sightings.

[chucker34]

Ditto on giving the DNR a round of applause. Like any private, public, or government organization, they are not perfect, but they are doing a heck of a job surveying hunters on matters like antler point restrictions and using their own expertise and observations to define seasons and bag limits based on individual areas. As a result, most of the state has a healthy deer population that will ensure hunters with the opportunity to harvest A deer. Might not be a monster but even those states with a reputation for monster bucks are not full of them. Good luck finding a monster in the hotspot areas of those states without paying through the nose to use an outfitter. I wonder if the fact that the outfitters own and control the land and can set their own antler point restrictions has anything to do with. That said, Minnesota has some of the best public hunting land opportunities anywhere - acrosss the board, deer, pheasant, duck, etc. And a large part of why we have this is thanks to management efforts by our DNR.

[slimngrizzly]

I think the DNR at a local level are great. But guys like Lou, what do we pay them for? Hes a specialist, I would think he would make sure anything is done to have the most controlled and healthiest herd possiible. Instead we have the uneducated public making desicions on how to manage a deer herd, AKA "the majority". Our DNR is to gutless to do whats right for the animals because they think a few people might be unsupportive of it.

We have a season that allows a free-for-all on bucks when their most vulnerable. Our ratio is 1:10 in most areas at best after the season. And just when you wouldnt think things could get any worse... we come up with an overpriced All Season license that puts presure on these deer like never before. Then fine tune it and make it so we can PARTY HUNT with it.

Im sorry, but aside from offering the 500,000 of us some prettty public land to go on, what "steps" in the RIGHT direction are being made?

[shae1986]

Everything you hear about that teh DNR isn't doing anything, Especaily Lou, is way off the map. He has been working hard with many deer hunters on what they beleive should be done because its not Lou's Deer Herd, its the hunters. Lou knows for a fact that the hunters are what keeps and manages this deer level at a low enough population. Now he wants some rules changed but without hunters wanting these rules it is very hard since we are teh ones that have to harvest the does. He has talked to many people where he asked if you had to only shoot big bucks would you shoot a doe instead and a lot of people said no. Thats where the problem is.

Ripping on the DNR is not the problem, before you rip on them rip on the other hunters that trophy hunt, but dont harvest any does in the process, this is why MN is considering Earn-a-Buck. That will sure make some people take some does early in the season.

[doser]

Off subject, but Harvey that buck in your avatar? Is that the one you shot in Donny Z. woods when I was with you at the young age of 13 ? If I remeber right it was about 80 yrds. dead sprint on your last shot?

[Lunker]

I'll shoot a doe long before I shoot a little buck. 8 pts or over for me, unless of course it was some odd case with a huge 6 pointer or something.Actually, even since I was a younger I was one of the starters at camp of the "don't shoot small bucks". So I've shot deer pretty much every year, all does until my 9 pointer last season. He showed up about 20 minutes after I watched a 5 pointer stroll past.

[shae1986]

I want to say something about my post, i think went over the line, dont rip on other hunters because we need to stay together to keep hunting alive in these days and times, I wasn't thinking of that when i posted. I would ask that we dont rip our DNR though either, even if what we think they are doing is wrong, they are using their expert knowledge of the deer herd to come up with a solution.

A. Shae

[BLACKJACK]

Quote:

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He has talked to many people where he asked if you had to only shoot big bucks would you shoot a doe instead and a lot of people said no. Thats where the problem is.

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I don't quite understand that, are you sure you've got that right????

A lot depends on how you ask the question. If you take a survey and ask hunters "Would you like to shoot more big bucks", of course 99% would say yes!!! But the dirty little secret behind QDM is that they want you to shoot more does, lots and lots more does, to the point where the herd is in better balance AND to the point where you might not be able to shoot a deer every year. So lets make sure the right question is being asked, as in "Would you like to shoot bigger bucks even if it meant that you may not be able to shoot a deer every year because we've reduced the doe population and put on antler restricitions?" If you asked that question I would bet that less than 25% of the deer hunters would agree.

I have my doubts about antler point restrictions. A lot of states out West that have had them for years are ending them because they don't work. They've found that the buck herd gets 'cropped off'/shot above the point restriction, and that they had a high shoot, count, and leave to rot percentage. Yet you hear the opposite from Pennsylvania, people say antler point restrictions are creating bigger bucks. Hard to know who to believe.

All I know is that deer hunting right now is as good as I've ever seen it. You can shoot an early bonus doe for the freezer, shoot another deer during gun season, and shoot another deer later on by bow or muzzleloader. I grew up when doe permits were treasured and if you didn't get one and you were only buck hunting, it was a loooooong season. I hope to never go back to anything like that again. I hope the vocal minority of hunters that want the DNR to legislate big bucks for them doesn't get there way. The big bucks are out there, go out there and HUNT them!!!

[shae1986]

What i ment by the question is that some people would either shoot a big buck or no deer at all, thats what the question is suppose to mean.

[chucker34]

Some good dialogue and BlackJack makes a lot of good points. And I would agree with his theory on QDM. Yes, I've been reading reports on how people in Pennsylvania have been seeing bigger deer, but I've also read reports how they've been seeing fewer deer overall. In some cases, guys said they would enjoy watching two dozen deer stream by in a day and now they're seeing two, two deer total in a day.

I don't want that. I like the taste of venison - no matter if its a doe, a little yearling, or a huge buck. I'd rather get at least one deer a year (hopefully more) rather than one big buck every five years or so. I think most hunters would and that's why they've consistently voted against antler point restrictions when surveyed by the DNR.

I'll get a big boy some year and decent ones others. It's bound to happen considering the effort I put into scouting and hunting - though maybe somewhat minimal compared to true trophy hunters.

Not everyone is a trophy hunter. Most people - even trophy hunters enjoy tagging a doe, expecially with a bow.

I hope the DNR continues to practice responsible managment practices for the sake of the overall herd and for the opportunities it presents to hunters. But I don't want them to go against the will of the people in terms of what deer they want to take every season.

There is a place for antler point restrictions and other QDM practices and its with each individual and on their own private land and leases, etc.

[Ray Mysterio]

Shae,

I agree with you about some hunters shooting a big buck but passing on all does.

I tend to think this way about shooting does.......

If I want more bucks on my property, I shoot does. Here is why, if I shoot a doe that has a buck fawn, that buck fawn will stay on my property. If I don't shoot the doe, she will kick the living crap out of that buck fawn as the season progresses so he will leave. (Natures way of preventing in-breeding) So if I shoot a doe, I keep that buck fawn on my property. Another plus of this is that the closer the buck to doe ratio gets to 1-1, the more affective calling, rattling, and scent use will be. Which equals more fun hunting.

I realize that if I shoot all does every year that might bring the population down. But I am a buck hunter, so I won't be shooting only does. My family owns 160 acres and we try and harvest about 2-3 does per year and 1 or two good bucks if we are lucky.

To answer the post question...

I would shoot any buck that has antlers out to the ears. I only have a few decent bucks under my belt and I intend to keep progressing in size as I shoot more bucks.

Mysterio

[subzero]

It looks like there are many different views to this topic. No doubt by the authors they are all right. I have read both sides and totally believe that if every buck in the woods was a BC buck that measurement wouldn't mean much. years back we had less hunters and we had less deer. Those hunters shot it if it was brown. Yet BC bucks have been recorded from the 60's and 70's when the unthinkable happened. The DNR closed the season. The doe permit showed up and the public was taught that shooting does was bad for the herd. I beleive that was a correct statement for the time. Now the deer herd has grow to much because of a string of easy winters and shooting bucks now is bad for the herd according to some individuals. ( Unless it is a trophy measured by them) When we have the next bad winter ( and we will have one ) we will once again be to the point where shooting doe's are bad for the herd. I do beleive bothsides of this discussion are correct to a point but I also would not want the job of telling the future to decide which side was right for the up coming year, every year. We wanted more deer, the DNR created a plan to get more deer. Job done. We want bigger bucks or at least some people do, if this is the bad winter and rules are made so we can't shoot small bucks and because there was a huge winter kill we can't shoot doe's it seems to me we are right back to 1970. Without a deer season only this time it will be our own doing, not because of over harvest though. Babbled enough this has no completly right answer.

[Rotwieler]

with a bow i wait for a good eight or better but im hunting a four intensive harvest tag area this year and im going to shoot all four does before the rut comes full swing to get the buck to doe ratio closer. with a rifle i look for the same but at the end of the season if i have a choice between a small buck or a doe, i "let the buck go so he can grow."