Party Hunting

[Getanet]

Another neat thing to note in a conversation I had with a CO last week is that people are getting duplicate tags.... They are tagging deer, get it home.... its all fine and legally tagged. But they are not registering the deer and then proceeding to get a duplicate license saying they lost the original and back afield they go.

Well, that's crappy, but what does it have to do with party hunting?

Those who want to cheat the registration system will always find a way.

[Eric Wettschreck]

The honest people are already honest. Outlawing party hunting is only going to effect those who do it legally already.

Quote:

Another neat thing to note in a conversation I had with a CO last week is that people are getting duplicate tags.... They are tagging deer, get it home.... its all fine and legally tagged. But they are not registering the deer and then proceeding to get a duplicate license saying they lost the original and back afield they go.

That has zilch to do with party hunting. That's poaching. Big diff.

[picksbigwagon]

Either one of you two going to call TIP? You need to report it to the DNR instead of here

[smallie_hawgin]

Do you guys honestly think that making party hunting and cross tagging against the law is going to stop the people who are already in violation while it's legal?

Not necessarily, but, it can make a difference... Just the simple language that would state your tag-your deer, period, would make enforcement considerably more simple and straight forward. As I eluded to earlier, the act of sharing the tag(s) degrades the value of that animal. It tends to make it a commodity rather than an individual accomplishment.

OTC... I agree.. It sucks. We need to do our part and call TIPS if we know this dump is going on... But, I would also truly like to see the "value" of a deer increased by making the individual responsible for their own tag. I also agree it's time.... Or we can continue with status quo and keep sticking our heads in the sand.... We could have much better quality, quantity and hunter experiences in this state... With proper deer management and enforcement. Just my .04

[Crappie Rage]

When you look at the fact that if you lose your hunting privileges in one state you lose them in something like 49 others. It will make a guy think twice when he can only hunt in Hawaii and Guam.

[PurpleFloyd]

Getting rid of party hunting is going to keep the honest people honest.

CO's job will get a LOT easier in regards to investigating party hunting violations.

Another neat thing to note in a conversation I had with a CO last week is that people are getting duplicate tags.... They are tagging deer, get it home.... its all fine and legally tagged. But they are not registering the deer and then proceeding to get a duplicate license saying they lost the original and back afield they go.

Just talked to a guy last night that had a friend up near Mille Lacs this weekend and the guy shot 3 deer... I had to ask where the heck he got tags.... One person was hunting with him and the 3rd tag was one he bought under his granddaughters name....

Isnt that just peachy??

it's also illegal.

[PurpleFloyd]

Simple fix.

One season for 7 days after the rut for all weapons. No bow hunting all season waiting for the perfect wall ornament while you pile up does with your other licenses.Party or solo hunt but be in the area if you party hunt.If a deer is transported without a tag take the deer and the truck. Give no replacement tags after the season starts.

[smallie_hawgin]

Simple fix.

One season for 7 days after the rut for all weapons. No bow hunting all season waiting for the perfect wall ornament while you pile up does with your other licenses.Party or solo hunt but be in the area if you party hunt.If a deer is transported without a tag take the deer and the truck. Give no replacement tags after the season starts.

Like most of it Purple, although, I will argue, "nothing is ever easy or simple" especially when it comes to enforcing and upholding regulations.... The problem as it reads now is still very similar to "Party or solo hunt but be in the area if you party hunt". How to easily and defensibly define that so a judge can't throw the case out. or a creative law breaker argue the contrary because of gray area.. CO's have wrestled with this for some time... Same area is too vague, but if you put 600 acres or within hearing distance.... It gets ugly. Still easier, safer, tighter and more ethical to do away with party hunting altogether.

Also, fish and game violation penalties are way to soft IMO... I wish we could get folks to pass something like you suggested... It would for sure make people think twice about it...

[Getanet]

Still easier, safer, tighter and more ethical to do away with party hunting altogether.

Safer? You're gonna have to explain how eliminating party hunting would make hunting safer. I'm assuming you're referring to deer drives, which could and would still be done, even if everyone had to shoot their own deer. And if deer drives is the basis for your argument, provides some facts please. Nearly every case I've read of someone being injured or killed in MN while hunting over the past few years was the result of falling out of a stand or accidentally shooting themselves.

More Ethical? To you maybe. Since you're a smallie fisherman I'm assuming you're heavily into C&R. In certain countries in Europe the practice of C&R is illegal and thought to be unethical. I doubt their belief makes you feel like an unethical fisherman. And of course there are lots of people who think killing a deer in any fashion is unethical. I simply point this out to show that it's hard to project personal ethics onto others.

[laker1]

There has been numerous injuries while making drives over theyears.

[Mr.Seaguar]

People get hurt falling out of tree stands.

[Eric Wettschreck]

People also accidently shoot themselves in their tree stand.

Eliminate party hunting due to safety and ethics? In other words, let the lawmakers define what you can and can't do for the good of public safety and what someone else thinks is ethical.

I get the fact that some fellas don't approve of party hunting or deer drives. That's just fine, don't do it. If you want to use individual effort to shoot a deer, that's great. Some of us like the team concept. I don't care if you sit in a tree for weeks waiting for your deer to show up. I hope you have fun. Why should anyone else care if myself and 4 other guys walk a grove?

I agree the penalties are soft. Don't use lawbreakers as an example to eliminate party hunting, tho. Plenty of lawbreakers out there sitting in trees all by themselves.

[Wanderer]

Simple fix.

One season for 7 days after the rut for all weapons. No bow hunting all season waiting for the perfect wall ornament while you pile up does with your other licenses.

That's an outdated practice these days too. And most people waiting for the perfect wall ornament go NO ornament most years.

As far as one season for 7 days after the rut all weapons go, you may as well say you're against deer harvest but here's your token hunt; take it or leave it.

[smallie_hawgin]

Safer? You're gonna have to explain how eliminating party hunting would make hunting safer. I'm assuming you're referring to deer drives, which could and would still be done, even if everyone had to shoot their own deer. And if deer drives is the basis for your argument, provides some facts please. Nearly every case I've read of someone being injured or killed in MN while hunting over the past few years was the result of falling out of a stand or accidentally shooting themselves.

More Ethical? To you maybe. Since you're a smallie fisherman I'm assuming you're heavily into C&R. In certain countries in Europe the practice of C&R is illegal and thought to be unethical. I doubt their belief makes you feel like an unethical fisherman. And of course there are lots of people who think killing a deer in any fashion is unethical. I simply point this out to show that it's hard to project personal ethics onto others.

Safer- Yes, I admit my perception as well as that of many other states, is based on the drive concepts... It's a matter of physics and proximity... Several hunters in a confined area with firearms reacting to a deer, likely running... CAN lead to multiple shots taken... And errant ones at that. It can be done safely, true, however reports in the media and from hunting groups suggest it's more common to have near miss issues than is typically heard in the media.

Ethical- Well, here is where there is a line that I described earlier where we all vary on our opinion of what is right, wrong, maybe not so bad.... Etc... And, I guess I am thankful I live in the states where we can practice C&R for bass or other species if we choose to...

We have conditioned ourselves (speaking broadly about MN hunters) that deer are meant for harvest... A rightful thought process on one hand, yet why do we allow is it acceptable to think that I should be able to harvest (if I am the lucky guy) deer for others in my group? We each buy a license (or tag) why not put that responsibility on the hunter rather than "any" individual in the group to harvest "my" deer?

It's completely understandable that this is "tradition" in MN and change is always tough to take, regardless of the topic. However, if we desire more out of deer hunting than just a harvest, if we value the opportunity, putting ourselves in the right spot, passing on deer even? What if our active land management/herd management let there be deer moving naturally enough you did not have to do deer drives? You could still hunt, stand hunt, ground blind hunt with the same effectiveness?

It starts with management, enforcement and yes, maybe even changing the way we think about deer hunting in MN. The enforcement piece with regards to party hunting has a large gray area that many people abuse to enable harvest of multiple animals per individual. It takes many hours to process a violation and then have a judge throw the ticket out due to a trivial complication related to "in the field".... Do we value deer hunting here? Or deer harvesting?

I only ask for discussion. I love venison, I am on the end of the spectrum where I feel like it is my own responsibility to harvest my own animal, and frankly would be PO'd if someone took it upon themselves to do that for me.... I love to hunt, period. Getting close enough to have an ethical bow shot is my challenge every year and I truly value the opportunity to do so....

I realize I am more on one side of the spectrum than some. Thankfully we live in a free country where we can have differing opinions and are able to voice them. Anyway, good discussion.... I hope to one day see a change, in what I would deem "greed" or absolute need to harvest a deer... And a deer population where (if we worked hard enough) there are ample opportunities to take an animal that I chose to... Not someone else do it for me. Again, my opinion....