Lowering our Low Expectations

[bowhunternw]

[DRAGFOOT]

What do you guys want? To be able to take a trophy every year?! Thats what makes a trophy buck so great, is that they are RARE!! If you started shooting them every year you would B*%$@h about something else.

[Getanet]

I pray the day comes where I have to bich about too many mature deer and it being too easy to get a big one!

No doubt that would happen. If there's one thing outdoorsmen like more than a cold beer and the Superbowl it's complaining about the DNR. Everyone talks about how great the hunting in Wisconsin is. All my relatives who live and hunt in WI complain about their DNR. All my relatives who live and hunt in MN complain about the DNR. I can't imagine it's much different in SD, ND, IA, KS or anywhere else.

No way the DNR is going to be able to please 500K hunters here, especially since everyone thinks their way is the right and only way to do things.

[snapcrackpop]

We need more public habitat and less tile-drained fields. Well at least in southern MN.

[leech~~]

If we all made a list of how our hunting has dropped off or how we see it here would be mine.

Deer-Ok still seeing and getting some.

Grouse- Down,not seeing or getting as many.

Ducks-Down-quit hunting them.

Pheasants-Down-quit hunting them.

Turkeys-OK getting better-getting some.

Rabbits-Down, I only hunt Snowshow-hardly see any!

Bear-OK but stopped hunting then, got enough.

[PurpleFloyd]

I would add this last year was the worst I remember for shooting striped gophers in my area. It was easily the worst season total I have had as long as I have hunted them going back to the 70's.

I wonder if Apr would fix that.

[JIvers]

I can't imagine it's much different in SD, ND, IA, KS or anywhere else.

It's no different in Iowa--I've lived in the southeast part of the state for over decade now, but still return to Zone 3 in Minnesota to hunt.

The Iowa DNR gets blasted by a lot of hunters here, mostly for allowing too many does to be killed over the last few years. To hear those people tell it, Iowa deer are in danger of being wiped out in some areas of the state. (And no, I don't believe Iowa deer are in any danger of extinction.)

No way the DNR is going to be able to please 500K hunters here...

Much less please every other group in the state with an interest in the deer population.

I know a few grain farmers in both SE Iowa and SE Minnesota who will tell you in all seriousness the deer herd should literally be wiped out due to the damage they cause to corn crops.

The Iowa DNR is Public Enemy # 1 for some hunters here, but the Farm Bureau comes in right behind them, along with auto insurance firms.

[SmellEsox]

Three of us just got back from Iowa last Friday. We saw over 30 bucks between the three of us and each of us saw some real bombers. It was amazing hunting.........on public land. MN hunting is awful in comparison.

[laker1]

Much of Minnesota is 400 miles north and much harsher winters and less fertile soil also.

[SmellEsox]

IA has other sources of mortality that MN doesn't have. EHD took out huge numbers of deer in IA the last couple years. I also think winterkill is rare in the ag regions of MN. We just flat out shoot too many antlerless deer and small bucks. Period.

[TruthWalleyes]

Whoever said horns don't taste good never traded them for a bag full of pheasants My 11ptr rack traded for pheasant will be delicious. Someone else can stare at them...I'll enjoy some 'italian pheasant'!

[96trigger]

Why do some of you consistently have to keep throwing little pot shots at anyone that is for seeing bigger racks? Every post by a couple of you has some snide remark in it about antlers, APR, or trophy hunting. I just don't get it. Keep driving that wedge boys, all you are doing is adding fuel to the fire.

[B. Amish]

because everyone else pot shots the dnr or their neighbors.

[Wanderer]

Agreed Trigger.

All the APR guys are scorned as trophy only hunters which is not true. Most APR guys are the people who see lots of deer and and have a better idea of what's truly out on the hoof not only in our home state but other areas as well. All APR guys have been talking about is mature deer, not just giants.

Deer hunting in this state is like fishing a small panfish hot spot 3 years after the word got out.

[B. Amish]

All the APR guys are scorned as trophy only hunters which is not true. Most APR guys are the people who see lots of deer and and have a better idea of what's truly out on the hoof not only in our home state but other areas as well.

they go to church more too. donate to charity more. swear less.

[Z7EXTERME]

My question is its an opportunity to actually tag a deer in mn. You have the right to purchase a license and go out and attempt to tag a white tail. Why doea everyone get so bent out of shape I hunt with a bow and firearms and a muzzle loader. I can shoot just as many deer with all three license as some one with a fire arms license just have a long time frame to fill my tags. Go buy a muzzle loader or a bow no one is stoping you from doing that. So quit blaming it on the people who enjoying being out there and hunting.

The past 3 years during firearms season has almost ruined deer hunting. Because everyone doesn't respect the outdoors they think I paid 31 dollars for a tag I need to shoot a deer by tresspasing shooting from the truck ect. Its unbelievable how many cry babies there are. Just like my grandpa taught me if you want something work your a$$ off to get it not wine or pay somebody money to get your way. People are ruining hunt with these [PoorWordUsage] poor attitude s.

[TruthWalleyes]

Why do some of you consistently have to keep throwing little pot shots at anyone that is for seeing bigger racks? Every post by a couple of you has some snide remark in it about antlers, APR, or trophy hunting. I just don't get it. Keep driving that wedge boys, all you are doing is adding fuel to the fire.

If what i said was a 'pot shot' you sure are sensitive.

[PurpleFloyd]

Why do some of you consistently have to keep throwing little pot shots at anyone that is for seeing bigger racks? Every post by a couple of you has some snide remark in it about antlers, APR, or trophy hunting. I just don't get it. Keep driving that wedge boys, all you are doing is adding fuel to the fire.

Not sure how that is any different than a guy posting a picture of harvested deer and having the APR crowd butt in and proclaim how the deer were too small, not mature, massacre etc etc etc. But I agree that we should be celebrating all those who achieve their own personal success and will try to be more tactful in the future as long as it is reciprocated. Heck, we should be accepting each others preferences and defending the right to hunt no matter what our standards are and focus on protecting our right to hunt from those who want to take it from us.

[picksbigwagon]

How many hunters bought tags this year, for all kinds of deer hunting (yes I realize there are multiple licenses for people how muzzie, bow and firearm hunt)? How does that stack up to other states? i.e. we have over twice as many as Iowa does, what about the rest of the big deer hunting states? Does Illinois have more than us? They definitely have more people than us.....

As far as the comments, I agree, both sides are guilty of it and it just keeps this topic going around and around. How many more years do we have to keep beating the dead horse? I am tired of it, but I know if I lock a topic, a new one pops up within 15 minutes and the conversation goes the same......

Population density (both deer, deer hunter, and non deer hunter) and land structure/carrying capacity, have a greater impact on deer "quality" than anything else that is ever mentioned.

[Wanderer]

they go to church more too. donate to charity more. swear less.

Hmmm.... I'd guess the Amish have me beat on all those fronts!

By the way Truth, I'm happy for you if you're happy with the trade. Personally, I wouldn't have given up the pheasants.

[TruthWalleyes]

By the way Truth, I'm happy for you if you're happy with the trade. Personally, I wouldn't have given up the pheasants.

I knew the guy who wanted the antlers had an abundance of pheasant from SD guide trips. I haven't pheasant hunted in a few years. Antlers were going to get tossed with the hide.

In my eyes, i got Way more than something for nothing. One's trash another's treasure.

[leech~~]

Huuum, I got a ton of deer head gear sitting in the Garage. How do I sign up for this pheasant SD guide trip deal?

[TruthWalleyes]

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[sticknstring]

Is that one of those rare melanistic albino deer? I've seen it all now.

[skee0025]

I know a few grain farmers in both SE Iowa and SE Minnesota who will tell you in all seriousness the deer herd should literally be wiped out due to the damage they cause to corn crops.

There are more than enough people willing to help them out, but the farmers either want your first born or are completely unwilling to allow people on their land. The help is there, if they refuse or make unrealistic demands so be it, let the deer feast!

[HunterLee]

APR is not all about big racks, its about management of deer. Quality and quanitity is not that hard to do. It would take a year or two but Mn can get to decent numbers in all areas along with good age structure.

Shoot does in areas that need it and lay off the in the ones areas that are down.

The biggest thing the dnr needs to do is "know" how many deer are in areas. All the western states have it figured out and only allow certain numbers of deer to be harvested in certain areas.

I know they do their flyovers in late winter, but how can you figure a population when all the deer in say 10-20 sq mile area are mostly in one deer yard. If they hit all of those or miss some of them areas there numbers will be way off.

We already have zones so why can't they allow x amount of bucks and y amount of does shot?

Limiting the harvest in each permit area would help both areas of concern. There is no way to determine the pressure that each area has.

As of right now, everyone in MN could hunt one zone if they wanted to, now what would that do to the size structure and population?

I go on one or two trips outside of MN every year and even on public land I see decent populations and decent age structure.

Its not possible for every hunter in MN to kill a deer every year and if they did we would have none left.

[HunterLee]

That also makes me think, when was deer hunter numbers lowest? I would venture to guess the 1980's due to seeing some of the monster racks my great grandpa had, and he/they were far from horn hunters and thats just what happen to come by. All 4 sets of his and 3-4 that another realitive has score well over 170 and all came from the late 80's as well as other random racks hanging in the older generation homes that I have seen.

[PurpleFloyd]

I don't know about your area but around here in the 80's there were probably 5x the hunters that there are now in this zone.From the reports of shots fired and hunters seen in the woods I can't see how there are more hunters today than in the past but I suppose some pockets probably are getting more pressure. Especially if word gets out that there is a big buck or two in the area. Word like that will bring in flocks of hunters looking to cash in on the rack.

I would be very very careful about proposing that we start to limit the numbers of licenses the state gives out while also increasing antler size unless you are either an outfitter, someone who makes a living off of supplying outfitters or a land owner trying to tailor your land to cash in on an outfitter locking up your property. I hear too many stories already on here about guys having people move in on their public stands, ruining their hunt by getting too close etc. It will not get any better with more big racks running around unless of course you are in the crowd that wants to reduce the number of hunters that can buy a license and if that is really your goal then I guess I will have to disagree with that idea.

[blue_healer_guy]

Everybodys expectations are what you make it in my mind. I go into every season looking for that "wow" buck. Never have seen one. I'm ok with that, sooner or later it might happen. My kids shoot the deer for our meat. They like the harvest part, the camp, etc. But what I can say is we are resposible for what we have. I"m talking more on the line of when your in a 1 deer zone, you know the same groups that hunt around you for years and you hear shots Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday etc from the same areas, wheres the problem. I would guess the actual harvest is higher by 15%.

[Jameson]

That also makes me think, when was deer hunter numbers lowest?....

Link to the hunter data tables from 1918-2008: https://app.box.com/shared/yce8comnsq

There was a dip in hunter numbers during the '70's, so maybe those racks came from the mid '80's when those bucks would have been 5-6 years old?????