MacNaughton Cup

[Bryce]

Maybe I need to pull some quotes with pre-season predictions from the beav faithful. I see some good points in everyone that came to their defense. Even so, I stand by my prediction. Glorified junior college that will consistently cruise the bottom of the league. A sweep of the Sioux? I agree it will happen. It will even happen at the Ralph eventually. Not a real lofty goal. I fail to see what the WCHA gained.

My dislike of the new teams only goes so far though. I have already admitted that beavs have a real good first line and sometimes that is enough come tourney time. They may help the upper level programs with their recruiting. Lot of MN talent on the east teams. Maybe keeping the local talent instate helps the league tourney wise. On the downside teams go into the tourney with hopes that they haven't lost their edge by possibly playing down to the level of their competition.

[scsavre]

Id take bemidji and get rid of AA any day,

[Bryce]

Agree. Not likely to happen. Pretty sure AA still pays a large fee to be in the league in addtion to covering all travel expenses for visiting teams. Throw out MT also. Have never heard anyone comment how they enjoy traveling there. What's Bemidji travel like for visitors. Can't imagine they get anything more than regional prop driven aircraft.

[cbrooks]

From the sounds of it. The WCHA will lose a couple teams with the Big Ten hockey starting. In a couple years the WCHA will look totally different. I've even heard of the WCHA combining with the CCHA.

[Scum Frog]

I'm really not a Sioux hatter,But is their any way MT can pull off a miracle this weekend? Maybe their will be a mandatory team party at Kristo house on Thursday night.

Bryce, your reference to Bemidji being nothing but a glorified junior college is once again ridiculous. I suppose UND send a lear jet to pickup it's visiting team?

[Bear55]

So Bryce what do you really want out of Bemidji, is it your wish that they close down their hockey program? I just don't get your beef with them.

[Bryce]

Enlighten me. Show me the acedemic diversification and all the accredited programs the school offers.

My issue not so much with the beav faithful so much as the league itself watering down the competition. Siuox vs rodents once a year is bush league. Beav fans did themselves no favors coming in predicting greatness in their first season. Very much like scsu fans.

[Bear55]

I don't really care about academic diversification, hockey is a niche sport for the most part I don't want to see programs cut for any reason. Especially a program like Bemidji who has a very rich hockey history (D2) and even more D1 NCAA tourney success in their short time then many of the schools across the country. Half the schools in the league are lacking this great academic diversification so that is kind of a weak argument.

You might say the league is watered down but you could also say the WCHA was watered down in the 70's, 80's, 90's when all the talent went to 3-4 teams and no once else had a chance. I'm not sure if you are paying attention but the quality of play of the smaller schools has been climbing a lot the past decade. Being a #1 seed in the NCAA tourney use to give you at least one easy game, that is not the case any more. There is a lot of talent out there and these little schools are sometime just 2-3 star players away from competing with the big schools. They aren't going to contend or have the talent every year but they can and do win games so I don't see the point in putting them down every chance you get.

Now I have no clue where I picked them at the beginning of the year, probably higher than they placed this year but they have shown plenty of fight in the NCAA's and when they played WCHA teams in the past so you just never know what they were capable of. Bemidji obviously couldn't handle the very hard WCHA schedule this year, not really a surprise. UNO on the other hand seemed to have stepped up to the challenge, that one isn't much of a shocker because they do have better coaching then the Sioux.

[cbrooks]

, that one isn't much of a shocker because they do have better coaching then the Sioux.

Oh yeah...Thats like your opinion Man[big Lebowski impression]

[Shorelunch]

Now I have no clue where I picked them at the beginning of the year, probably higher than they placed this year but they have shown plenty of fight in the NCAA's and when they played WCHA teams in the past so you just never know what they were capable of. Bemidji obviously couldn't handle the very hard WCHA schedule this year, not really a surprise. UNO on the other hand seemed to have stepped up to the challenge, that one isn't much of a shocker because they do have better coaching then the Sioux.

I picked BSU 7th. They let a lot of Friday night leads slip away and lost a few OT games as well. However, you could say that about a lot of lower to middle of the pack teams. They also had a difficult start of the year too, opening the new barn and schedule wise. Next year will be a tough year for the program, especially one that had a tradition of winning in the CHA, with a strong senior class (Matt Read) graduating. Remember, 2011-12 will be their first year with WCHA recruits stepping on the ice. It will take them 3-4 years to build quality top lines and skilled depth. As far as coaching, I'd take most teams' coaches, with a few exceptions, but both UND and BSU coaches have their own battles to fight on and off the ice.

[Bear55]

Oh yeah...Thats like your opinion Man[big Lebowski impression]

You know I can't pass up an opportunity to take a shot at the Sioux. After the past 4 seasons that is all us Gopher fans have.

[Bryce]

Maybe some of what I said was taken out of context... or it just shows that I wasn't an english major. Glorified junior college is directed at the college as a whole. Hockey team has proven to be D1 worthy. Not WCHA imo but take that for what it's worth. I think several other teams should be in other leagues as well.

I repeat saying. This is hockey tournament time. 1 good line and a hot tender is good enough at any level. Especially if your team can get into a one and done situation.

Not buying that current beav players had no idea that they would be playing at this level. WCHA doesn't just add a random team overnight. They've known for several years this was coming. Same with a new building. Not a weekend project. One could argue that the newness of these two events gave them a recruiting boost.

[Shorelunch]

Not buying that current beav players had no idea that they would be playing at this level. WCHA doesn't just add a random team overnight. They've known for several years this was coming. Same with a new building. Not a weekend project. One could argue that the newness of these two events gave them a recruiting boost.

BSU built their new barn on basically a leap of faith. WCHA stated that if they build a new barn, they will have a legitimate chance of membership. Getting the building approved was a two year process in Bemidji, with location changes, a slim margined city-wide vote and mayoral/city council elections. Even with the eventual groundbreaking on the barn, there was still uncertainty that the WCHA would take BSU, because there would have been 11 teams (odd ball schedules), until UNO decided they would move forward and join. It was also unexpected that BSU would play the 2011-12 season as a WCHA member and not as an independent - UNO was able to make this a bargaining chip in order for them to join the WCHA. It has been two years since BSU made their presentation to the WCHA (before the Frozen Four run). Recruits are generally one-to-two years away from playing/Freshman once they commit. BSU's Seniors - Soph's and probably most Freshmen were 100% CHA recruits who committed to an unstable program and conference.

[Bear55]

Other than UM and WI every school in the league could be labled a glorified jr college. However I do hear the Colorado schools and Tech offer some excelent academic diversification. I have heard rumors that UND is going to start a world class Frostbite Treatment Center, that way they won't have to send their players down to Gopher territory for medical assistance.

[Bryce]

Shorelunch: Highly doubt they recruited with a pitch like that. Sticking with my last sentence in the quote.

Bear: That right there is pretty funny. You rodent fans are hanging on by a thread aren't you? Back to to backs don't seem quite so neat when the reality sets in that you go 30 years in between championships. Sounds like you, along with many others, don't realize how complete UND is. Med school, law school, full business program, engineering, and more plus arguably the most elite aviation program in the world.

[Bear55]

You rodent fans are hanging on by a thread aren't you? Back to to backs don't seem quite so neat when the reality sets in that you go 30 years in between championships. Sounds like you, along with many others, don't realize how complete UND is. Med school, law school, full business program, engineering, and more plus arguably the most elite aviation program in the world.

I think our thread broke a while back, I think we have to win the FF or go home, not an easy task but it is nice to see them showing some life again. Back to backs are still cool, no reason to hit the panic button yet. The Sioux on the other hand remind me of those great Gopher teams from the 80's and 90's, always in the hunt but never win the big one.

Don't worry I know what UND offers, I just like to rile up the Sioux fans whenever possible.

[Shorelunch]

Shorelunch: Highly doubt they recruited with a pitch like that. Sticking with my last sentence in the quote.

BSU did not recruit using "trust me, we're going to be in the WCHA in three years - it's a done deal." They laid the cards on the table and told the recruit what has been accomplished and what was still up in the air. Program/conference was still in question up until 1.5 years ago. If it wasn't for UNO joining, and to a lesser extent the F4 run, BSU could have been easily in the same situation as Huntsville.

[Bear55]

A new rink will help with recruiting but at this stage being part of the WCHA is going to give them a bigger impact, the combination of both should help even more. Uncertainty can put a big hurt on recruiting and there clearly has been some uncertain times in Bemidji the past few years.

Now Bemidji faces some different problems, they can probably out recruit Huntsville and some of those smaller Eastern schools for local and Canadian talent who who want to play in the WCHA. However, if they want to step up there are going to snag some recruits from some of the other WCHA schools not named UofM, UND, or WI. Bemidji is going to have to gamble every now and then and offer full rides to guys who might not get that kind of scholarship at other schools. It also wouldn't hurt to be able to pull a diamond out of the rough every now and then, they seem to be doing ok at that so far because they have had a handful of very talented players come through recently.

[Shorelunch]

A new rink will help with recruiting but at this stage being part of the WCHA is going to give them a bigger impact, the combination of both should help even more. Uncertainty can put a big hurt on recruiting and there clearly has been some uncertain times in Bemidji the past few years.

Now Bemidji faces some different problems, they can probably out recruit Huntsville and some of those smaller Eastern schools for local and Canadian talent who who want to play in the WCHA. However, if they want to step up there are going to snag some recruits from some of the other WCHA schools not named UofM, UND, or WI. Bemidji is going to have to gamble every now and then and offer full rides to guys who might not get that kind of scholarship at other schools. It also wouldn't hurt to be able to pull a diamond out of the rough every now and then, they seem to be doing ok at that so far because they have had a handful of very talented players come through recently.

I agree. I think BSU will now be on an even playing field with UAA, SCSU and MSU. They'll also be up against UMD and UNO. I would imagine, every once in a while, they'll steal a blue chipper from the bigger hockey schools providing a full scholarship. They'll still need to recruit just as hard as they ever have (maybe more now with more pressure to win in a more talented league), but at least now they're driving a Ford Fusion instead of a '76 Pinto.

[solbes]

Agreed. BSU now has 3 things that give them cred, where it was missing even 2 years ago. 1) New Facility, 2) WCHA membership, and 3) Proven NCAA success from 2009. Those 3 should be enough to sustain some lasting recruiting power. Not in the likeness of the big 3 or 4 WCHA schools, but enough to compete with the big boys.

It used to be that schools like UMD, MSU, and Saint Cloud to some extent were every 3 or 4 year schools. That is they would generate a strong enough class plus goaltending to make a credible playoff push on a semi-regular schedule. It seems with the highly talented guys leaving the big schools early after Freshman or Sophomore years(Gophers for example), the playing field has been leveled somewhat. Bemidji will benefit from this just as some of the other smaller schools have in the past 2 or 3 years.

[cbrooks]

UND was presented the MacNaughtoncup after the game tonight. Not one player would touch the trophy. Supersititious

[Steve Foss]

UND was presented the MacNaughtoncup after the game tonight. Not one player would touch the trophy. Supersititious

Nah. Frostbitten fingers.

[cbrooks]

Last year Steve they paraded that trphy around the arena. These guys want a NCAA trophy. I know same story as before and the story before that. This time I believe it will get done. I wander what Virg will write about tomorrow in his commentary. Go Sioux

[Steve Foss]

I didn't ask what he wrote. We're at my Grammie's (his mom's) 103rd birthday party today. It's always interesting to read what goes on in the old man's hockey mind.

Not to mention, I always find out a thing or two about Sioux hockey that never made the papers.

[cbrooks]

I didn't ask what he wrote. We're at my Grammie's (his mom's) 103rd birthday party today. It's always interesting to read what goes on in the old man's hockey mind.

Not to mention, I always find out a thing or two about Sioux hockey that never made the papers.

Yep. I know Virg wrote about granny Maebal Evelyn Johnson Foss 103rd birthday at Northfeild.

I bet Steve you got all the goods.

[Bear55]

Last year Steve they paraded that trphy around the arena. These guys want a NCAA trophy. I know same story as before and the story before that. This time I believe it will get done. I wander what Virg will write about tomorrow in his commentary. Go Sioux

Those NHL guys do that all the time, crazy staticstics... 50% of them don't win the cup 100% of the time.

[scsavre]

Didnt Denver win the Mcnaughton cup last year.