4 day youth deer hunt state wide during teachers convention

[buckhunter21]

I think its a great way to get more kids excited about hunting. Its probably true that most parents that dont hunt probably wont take their kid hunting just because of a special season but maybe another relative or neighbor would be willing to take them out for a few days. I know Im not the only one that would be willing to give up a few days of bow hunting to take someone out who maybe would never have been introduced to hunting otherwise. With the way the season is now it would be alot harder because we already have too many hunters on our property and bringing another hunter in would be alot harder at least in my situation but with a special season you would have alot of land to yourselves including less pressure on state land which would hopefully increase the odds of getting a deer and getting them hooked on the sport.

[bottom-bouncer]

The south dakota season is on the to do list for several friends who are taking their kids there next fall. Nonresident license is $10. Very extended window of opportunity (sept to jan). So while there are fewer people residing there, it is an opportunity for any who can travel there, and the non resident license cost obviously not a barrier.

Having kids of your own does tend to create a different mindset about long term future of the sport, and generally an greater willingness to do without yourself so someone else benefits.

lakevet

I do have differnt mind set about the future of the sport being I have 6 kids. They dont need a special season. Did you have a special season I didnt. If they want to be hunters then they need to know what it takes. If they dont like the coldthen they need to communicate that to me and I will make sure that they get the opportunity to get out bowhunting and they can stay home when it gets cold. People say that kids now days are lazier than ever I agree 100% they are because as a whole we as a society have failed todays youth. I would bet anything that most have made every attempt to make our childrens lives as easy as possible. We are not doing them any favors we are making them lazier. They dont have to work hard to achieve things why mom or dad will do it for them. I know this I used to do it I made it so easy for them to hunt and fish. No more a few years ago I realized if they want it they have to work for it. I do not remove fish for any of them anymore not the 4 year old girl not the sixteen year old boy. The ones who are old enough to hunt carry there own stuff (deerstands,weapon of choice,lunch,drink, etc..) Why should I do all the work my dad didnt do it for me and I am still hunting and fishing and I am a better outdoorsman for it. Its no wonder kids are lazy and that they are the way they are. If its not given to them they have no interest. It kills me when I read some of these posts in wich people say that me or like minded people who are against this are accused of being selfish! Really so I am selfish because I do not want this Because It WILL mess up my bowhunting! But you are not selfish by stating your child should get to hunt before the adults it doesnt matter if it ruins my hunting as long as your special kid gets special prividges. NEWS FLASH!! If your child choses not to particapate in hunting because they didnt get a special season then chances are they were not going to be hunters anyway!!!!!! sorry so long winded folks. I am sick of hearing about what special treatment kids need. life is not fair nor is it eqaull!!

[tweedlap]

bottom-bouncer.

Perfectly analyzed and stated !

You are raising the kind of kids that will be good hunters and

sportsmen !

I commend you on your parenting skills. Nice work.

tweed

[Jameson]

Well said Bottom-bouncer.

I am starting to believe it is the parents who do not wish to take the time away from their own hunt that are the ones being greedy.

[laker1]

We all want kid to appreciate and enjoy the outdoors, I just think kids have to learn to appreciate the outdoors first(no quick fixes), otherwise it loses it appeal and is not cool. You do this by starting at day one and taking your kid out with you while he is young and not leaving him home because he may get bored and slow you down in pusuit of your game. I am all for youth getting first shot at doe permits, but the youth deer season over MEA(which is the busiest small game weekend of the year) will create many conflicts with other users, many will be youth out for the first time with the 410 on their first grouse hunt. Were cramming to much in a already closed season. I would not mine if some of the parks would have special youth hunts. Than it could be controlled and nutured.

[chub]

Why thank you SAM

Some of the others have stated what my thoughts are much more eloquently than I probably could have

The future of hunting and fishing rests soley on the youth that are going to be out there regardless of a special "youth season". For those that are fortunate enough to have kids that want to go, and are taken along regularly, kudos to you! You're doing the right thing. It's what got 99% of us where we are today.

For those that claim this would be a great opportunity to get their kids into the woods and devote the whole time to teaching......... what's been stopping you now? You could do it during the regular season...., you could go out over MEA and sit in a stand sans firearm, and teach the game armed with a camera.

Guess all I'm saying is the opportunity to teach kids and bolster the future has been there all along. No special "youth season" required. You just have to take time out of YOUR schedule to do it.

The future doesn't hinge on "special opportunities". It depends on parents doing what parents did for generations. Obviously the "youth hunts" aren't going hurt future license sales long term(nor do I think it will vastly increase #'s), but what it does do, is give us more to argue and fight about short term.

[fivebucks]

First off, bottem bouncer spelled it out the way it should. But that being said, if the early season would actually get more kids into the sport for a lifetime I would be partially for it. The fact of the matter is that if someone would take a kid deer hunting in October, I bet over 90% of those same kids will be in deer camp come November regardless of if the got to go in October. I just don't think too many adults who don't deer hunt will take their kids out in October - they don't know what to do. My dad did not hunt so therefore I did not hunt until I got a drivers license. I've hunted ever since. If there is a passion they will find a way. Of course it helps to have great friends to hunt with.

[RumRiverRat]

No need for a special youth season.

The youth today expect to be catered to.

Why give them what they want?

[lungdeflator]

No need for a special youth season.

The youth today expect to be catered to.

Why give them what they want?

No. And Yes. Being 20 years old, I can look back at those 20 years and see that I have lived what B-B described above. I started sitting in trees when I was 10 years old, without a weapon, while my dad sat in a tree on the other side of the property. He let me sit when ever I wanted and I did all thoughout September and into late November. I learned most everything I know about deer today by myself. Going out and doing things yourself and making mistakes is the best way to learn.

This early youth season is a good idea if the age is limited to under 12. 16 and 17 year olds getting to hunt for 2.50$? If you are old enough to drive a car, your old enough to pay full price for a license. Also as I stated before, its not only a 4 day window to the outdoors in October. The parents should be taking their kids outside long before this and teaching and scouting.

The scariest thing for me would be the thought of some kid who has grown up killing zombies on their playstation and thinking that hunting is just another video game.

[96trigger]

Would the 16-17 year old kids have to be accompanied by an adult?

It wasn't uncommon for me at that age to hunt with my friends, and form a hunting party. That could screw up some bowhunting, small game, etc...

I am all for a youth season, but I think there should be some compromise as to how it is run.

Kids 13 and under must be within arms reach of parent. 14-17 must be in the immediate vicinity. Maybe shorten it to one weekend instead of 4 days.

One of the biggest things I got out of a recent meeting about our whitetails is how we give people the opportunity to hunt deer with a firearm 6 straight weekends and how that impacts our deer herd. This would make it 7.

No drives or crosstagging would also be a great addition, etc... I think this can get done with minimal complaint as long as common sense is used.

One of the greatest things about deer season for me growing up was getting ready for deer opener. Will this change the way kids look at deer opener? The kids already get to hunt all seasons in zone 3. Do they need more? I know lots of people hunt pheasants, ducks, grouse, and small game hard during MEA. We used to camp in the woods and hunt small game. It would have been different if we could hunt deer. I believe I became a better deer hunter because I hunted other species. I get more familiar with my gun and my surroundings. I see the instant gratification society everyday.

I can see the pros, but I can also see the cons without being selfish. I am a big bowhunter, and I truly don't think that this will mess up bowhunting any more than the small gamers or pheasant hunters. In the end, we all have to share the resources.

[Bear55]

I have to agree with others, a special youth season filled with kids who spend all fall in the woods anyway isn't going to change much. Starting to program to get younger kids (5 to 15) out fishing and hunting who don't already have some one to take them would get more people into the woods and on the lakes.

[Musky Buck]

My long winded sermon was getting at that point. We started out by fishing, then single shot grouse gun, then the waterfowl weapon, and then gun safety/training, then I felt like I was joining the "bigtime" able to deer hunt while fishing year after year. Trigger you are right on about the progression of learning how to handle different guns and hunt different species, it readied us for handling high powered equipment(guns). It made us aware of respecting other hunters and anglers. As much as I hunted from 6 years of age and on, I'm not so sure I needed to have a 30-06 in my hands until I was 13 and I was an early maturer. I say to some make the sacrifice, give up the best deer stand and let the kid hunt it, be there with them. It's why old zone 4 worked so well, dad could take me one of the weekends and hunt the other.

[snapcrackpop]

The Star Trib. story mentioned doing away with the minimum age requirement, but didn't see that on the DNR web site.......

[Coach1310]

To be honest.... I am kinda shocked by some of the feelings in this thread.

#1. The bottom line here is for a lot of us on this site, outdoors is a passion. We experience it any chance we get. There is a pretty good chance our children will enjoy it as well. This proposed season isn't exactly directed at OUR children, but those children in your neighborhood who don't get a chance to get out. If you had a few days to take a neighborhood kid, niece, nephew, etc. out in the woods would that be a bad thing?? If you leave it as is, most folks aren't going to take that kid to deer camp with them, but with a "special hunt" that may afford them the opportunity.

#2. The affect on pheasant/grouse/waterfowl seasons.... They all overlap already, so what is the big deal. Maybe we should make it so none of them overlap at all and then you won't have this issue.

#3. The affect on archery hunters.... We already have 3 1/2 months to hunt.... will 4 days really kill you???

#4. I think it may be time for some to start looking at the big picture... it has been mentioned in this thread already, but without getting kids involved you can bet that our funding for outdoor conservation will go down in flames in the future. Some seemed so worried about their little world and someone rifle hunting 300 yards from their bowstand on MEA weekend, when it has always been their BIG weekend to bowhunt!! The whole entitlement thing is kinda funny in my opinion...

#5 The whole notion that "I didn't have this" or "when I was a kid.." ... When you were a kid, you rode in the back window of the car on road trips.... is that still a great idea now?? The world is different. Are there things that were more effective years ago that we don't do much now, sure. No matter what the rules are, adults will raise their children the way they feel is best, so saying this hunt will add to their demise is just a way to say you don't like the idea, without really stating why. If you think it is coddling your kids, then have them stay home

I just can't see much negative about the whole idea. The outdoors in such a great thing to all of us on here and we are so passionate about it, why can't we try a little harder to share that with more people. This special youth hunt could lead to you taking your neighbor and his son/daughter out for their first hunt to see what it is like. It affords another opportunity .... just like what most folks want when talking about season date changes, no cross tagging, elminating party hunting.... Why do folks want these??? Because they think it will lead to MORE OPPORTUNITIES to harvest a Big Buck....

I sincerely appreciate the thoughts of Canopy Sam, Mike Wallace, goblue and others..... after reading the first couple of pages, I couldn't believe it.... thanks for giving the idea some thought.

**** I am under the impression that it will be for 10-15 year olds, not any age***

[rayguy]

It would be insane to let a 5 -7 year old hunt with a firearm. How many of us want to be in the woods or fields with a youngster just removed from the potty training years. I was in the service with 17 year olds that were not mature enough to be carrying a rifle. Lets not go overboard.

[heat checker]

I would have no problem letting my 7 yr old hunt with a firearm. All shells in my pocket until on stand, then one in magazine, not transfered to chamber until shot presents itself. Me sitting beside him talking him through it. Don't see that as a problem.

The rest of you must bowhunt much better area than what I do. I have until slug season to fill my tag, after that, the deer are nocturnal and I rarely see any. That gives me a few days of hunting the "rut", which really hasn't got going yet. Add a 4day kid season mid October, and the time it takes the deer to get back to a normal pattern, I've got a two week window "pre rut" to hunt unpressured deer. Add the month of early season, and suddenly, my 3.5 month bowhunting season is down to 1.5 months. No thanks. I would not have any problem mentoring a young bowhunter (after I've finished the last of my own kids). I would be more willing to sit beside a youth during the regular firearms season. I just think between the firearms and muzzy, there is already too much gun season.

[Mike Wallace]

For those that claim this would be a great opportunity to get their kids into the woods and devote the whole time to teaching......... what's been stopping you now? You could do it during the regular season...., you could go out over MEA and sit in a stand sans firearm, and teach the game armed with a camera.

Guess all I'm saying is the opportunity to teach kids and bolster the future has been there all along. No special "youth season" required. You just have to take time out of YOUR schedule to do it.

The future doesn't hinge on "special opportunities". It depends on parents doing what parents did for generations.

Thank you, Chub. These sentences put the proposal in perspective for me and made the light bulb light up.

The comments of many folks on here in the last couple pages have made this a discussion that is worth reading (I was worried after the first couple pages). The posts have been well stated, polite, and passionate about kids, hunting, and parenting.

Getting our youth in the outdoors, hunting, and fishing is an important part of our culture that we have a responsibility to pass on, whether we have kids or not. Ultimately, whether there is a special youth hunt or not, it won't change peoples lives significantly. A few more kids may go, some will disrupt others' hunts, you may be inconvenienced, or there may be unethical behavior. That may all happen...or not.

As Chub stated so well - take the time out of YOUR schedule to do it.

Mike Wallace

[bottom-bouncer]

I would like to shed some light here. I read these posts and there is a huge misconseption Bow hunters do not have 3 and 1/2 months. The season may last that long but its not reality. Once the orange army hits the woods bow hunting is pretty well done. Yes there are rare ocasions but they are few and far between. Unless you really do bowhunt you will probably not understand. So I will try and explain it. When you are gun hunting generally speaking if you can see it you can kill it. That is not the case with bowhunting. Think of it this way when you are out hunting during gun season How hard is to locate and harvest a mature buck? It is very hard correct and you can take a shot at 200yds or more. Now try and put that same deer within twenty or thirty paces. Now shoot at that same deer with a gun and try and get that close with a bow near impossible. so please dont let that 3 and 1/2 month season fool you.

[hockeybc69]

So I must me missing somtething big.....

Take time out of MY schedule to take a kid hunting?????

What the heck??? Its never been about taking time out of my schedule for my kids, my nephew or my friends son up to this point.

Living through the kids eyes, fills my voids as a kid.

Frickin take a kid hunting, who needs a special season.

Is this some extension of, "No child left behind"?

[lakevet]

When I started hunting 26 yrs ago, regular rifle season was bucks only, doe permits few. We hunted deer and competition with other hunters were not an issue in our area, even on public land. With time that changed to the point where we gladly gave up the rut hunt zoo to muzzy hunt with just us and the spooky, remaining smart deer that had survived, under conditions usually colder and averaging an hour less shooting light due to the shortening days. It was like being a kid again for all of us. Hunting strategy went back to what the deer would do, not what all the other hunters are doing. Now that has changed in our area where we are back to competing against more and more muzzy hunters(most who have already hunted centerfire rifle season and many archery season too) instead of deer hunting. A youth season could provide kids a chance at something that is getting harder to experience, hunting deer in uncrowded woods instead of competing against an army of other hunters.

lakevet

[hockeybc69]

Quote:

instead of competing against an army of other hunters.

Compete against hunters going after grouse, pheasant, duck, archery(deer), turkey, and whatever else is in the woods.

[bottom-bouncer]

If this happens can we partician to get a special season to shoot from the road cause I am getting lazier and fatter. And am sick of all the work invovled in tradional hunting!! IN ALL SERIOUSNESS! I have a question why is it when the mention of moving the firearm season out of the rut is brought up people are quick to say deer hunting in november is a tradition. Can someone tell me why that statement has no bearing on a kids hunt in october? Its not a tradition.

[lakevet]

We already have a youth waterfowl season so kids don't have to compete with the entire waterfowl hunting group. Youth can enjoy a waterfowl hunt with less chance of conflict with other hunters ( a sure recipe to sour a young hunter on the sport) and less pressured game. We adults adjusted to that, youth deer is no different. Maybe we should have pheasant, archery deer, turkey, and grouse youth openers before the rest of us have at it.

lakevet

[laker1]

I see from the above posts and observations of my own, the reason most young people do not enjoy doing outdoor activities is that the parents etc. do not take the time to acclimate individuals to hunting etc.. It is just not one last attempt- special event(stop gap) to get them hunting. You have to get them to appreciate the outdoors for what it is and decide once a year you set a day aside to take the kid with you. T o raise a youth or mentor its called sacrifice on your side. Although the reward for you individually is also great.

[laker1]

What I meant you have to set aside and put more effort than one day a year to get results. No quick fixes.

[96trigger]

Interesting read guys. Just curious as to how many that are opposed bowhunt? How many that are opposed have kids? Also, how many that are for it, bow hunt and have kids. I don't need anyone to say this, just think about why you might oppose it. Is it truly because you never got that opportunity as a child? is it because you don't want someone messing up your bowhunting?

I don't pretend to have the answers, I do know that family size is decreasing. Kids that hunt and fish are also decreasing due to many varying influences ranging frm parents that don't hunt (anymore) to too many school responsibilities.

I am lucky enough to teach in a school full of hunters. I am lucky enough to have started a club in this school fully dedicated to hunting. Many, if not all, of these kids could join me on a hunt at any time. These kids get ultra excited for the opening of deer season. I like that it coincides with my opener. There is an excitement, a buzz so to speak in the school before deer opener. We spend all fall looking at trail cam pics and talking/dreaming about the big bucks that we have pictures of. I am excited that they might have the opportunity to have their own hunt. I am disappointed because it might take away from the excitement that kid might have awaiting the deer opener with his/her family.

I hope the intent of this season is to get kids that maybe wouldn't have a lot of opportunity to deer hunt out in the woods. I hope the intent of this season is to get kids that might have a hard time being successful during regular firearms, a higher chance of success. For the above to happen. It will take men and women like you and me to take a kid hunting that maybe doesn't get that chance. Take your kid and put them in the primo stand that is normally used by uncle Fred, who shoots a deer on opening morning every year.

These kids are the future of our sport. It is their funding that will enable the hunting tradition to continue. In the future, their will be a war on the hunting tradition as we know it. We need these kids, lots of them, to enjoy hunting and keep the tradition going.

[laker1]

well said trigger

[Coach1310]

I hope the intent of this season is to get kids that maybe wouldn't have a lot of opportunity to deer hunt out in the woods. I hope the intent of this season is to get kids that might have a hard time being successful during regular firearms, a higher chance of success. ...........

These kids are the future of our sport. It is their funding that will enable the hunting tradition to continue. In the future, their will be a war on the hunting tradition as we know it. We need these kids, lots of them, to enjoy hunting and keep the tradition going.

Well put trigger... to me, that is exactly what the youth hunt should be about. Like I stated earlier, I think this is much more about the average kid than the ones whose families have the outdoors as a passion. For the record, I have 2 children(soon to be 3), I am a casual bowhunter, casual small game and pheasant hunter and spend 4-5 days per year hunting with a firearm during rifle season.

[CANOPY SAM]

Well.... This has become quite the interesting topic! I appreciate everyone's input here, be it negative or positive. We're all entitled to our opinions on this subject, so the "who's right or wrong" argument doesn't really hold any water.

Personally, I think it's fascinating how many tangents this one topic has branched out into. There are worthy discussions on both sides of the fence, but attacking, and or pointing fingers at each other on moral or ethical issues, or parenting styles, without knowing all the information, is just inappropriate and unnecessary.

For the record, my children are not fat and lazy, nor do they expect to get catered too. They are healthy, joyful, exhuberant kids, who love being outside, love being with and helping others, and most importantly love and respect the Lord, their parents, and other adults.

I have spent time in the woods, and on the water with all of them, helping and hoping to cultivate a love of the outdoors in each of them. Some have a passion for hunting and fishing, and some do not. I have no desire to force my kids to like, or participate in something just because I do. I give them opportunities, and choices, and leave the rest up to them.

We all have different styles of learning, as well as teaching. Some believe in the time-honored methods of raising kids, and some subscribe to a gentler, more hands on approach. Both methods work. Let's leave it at that.

This morning I backed up and read the article that was printed in the Trib to see if I could find some clarity on the issue. Thanks for providing the link.

Now please correct me if I'm wrong, as there are still some unanswered questions in there, but the way it sounds to me is the DNR is planning on "simplifying" the regs in regard to youth deer hunting. I am all for this. Reading and understanding the regulations as they pertain to the different seasons has become a nightmare. Just the regs on youth hunting are confusing - as this entire conversation gives evidence to.

What I interpret is that the multiple, region specific, youth deer hunts throughout our state will be consolidated into one state-wide, 4-day, either sex, general youth deer hunt, with age range limits as yet to be determined. Does this sound about right?

As far as I can see, this would result in creating more open days of hunting for other species, without youth deer hunters afield, as the current (multiple) seasons encompass more than four days collectively. So this should actually benefit hunters pursuing other game throughout the entire hunting season.

I don't disagree at all that adults can take their kids hunting during the regular deer firearms season, and this can be, and is a learning experience in and of itself. However, as I stated earlier, even I am somewhat nervous about being out there with 400,000 other rifles in the woods. I'm not completely comfortable taking my kids in the woods at this time of year.

The youth firearms season plain and simply offers a safer environment, with exponentially less competition for resources. I have no doubt my perspective is biased, as in our region there are very few youth hunters afield during this season. There's virtually no competition. I'm sure near the larger MN cities this might be very different.

The DNR acknowledges that this won't be a "cash cow" for them. I admire that this federal and state appointed office is launching a campaign to make things easier for everyone involved without regard to making money in the end. It's commendable.

I don't pretend to know all the right answers for every particlar scenario as it applies to statewide resource management. I can't even comprehend the challenges and barriers our state officials have to face when attempting to appease every hunter, fisherman or landowner in our great state. I have friends that work in the DNR, and I know I wouldn't want their job. It's often thankless, and an easy target for anyone who doesn't directly benefit from an otherwise well designed and well intentioned proposal.

I have experienced the blessings that come out of the designated youth hunting seasons in our state, and I've seen the joy these opportunities have brought to my, and many of my friends children.

If I have to give up a couple more days of my hunting seasons to focus my attention on my kids, and their learning experience in the outdoors, hunting and fishing, I would never look at it as a loss, or sacrifice. I'm happy to do it. I look at it as a gift, and I appreciate the State of Minnesota's willingness to make this possible for our children. The pro's far outweigh the cons.

[goblueM]

fantastic post... well written and thought out. hard to disagree with your logic or your respectful attitude!