Grouse Hunting from ATVs

[SledNeck]

Ive been in the woods chasing birds and have seen ATVs go by with uncased loaded guns in one hand and steering with the other hand.

Theres even a guy that lives near me that has a springer he takes hunting while he drives the ATV! lol

[Matt Breuer]

If somebody is walking and ground pounds a grouse it ok but to take them from the atv or car is a whole different issue.

Huh?

[Basseyes]

Originally Posted By: Basseyes

It just begs and raises the question for me, do you shoot at running deer to give them a more sporting chance?

So you drive your 4-wheeler up to a deer standing in the road and shoot the deer in the back of the head?

Nice way to justify ground pounding grouse.

I love and respect grouse. Do not think it is fair to compare them to a whitetail. A whitetail is far more intelligent and very rarely would it stand close enough for a shot out in the open on a forest road in season like ruffed grouse are prone to do. I do however question the term "sporting chance". I understand it just have some issue with the ideal that one thing needs to be flying to improve it's chances of survival vs making sure of your target and respecting the creature enough to make a quick clean kill. There's some under lying hypocrisy somewhere in there which I'm sure I'm guilty of all the time in other areas. It's an interesting can of worms for the un informed non hunter.

I do not hunt off a 4 wheeler.

I do not shoot grouse on the ground.

There are times I give grouse in trees a pass. Then there are times I harvest them perched on their limbs. It feels good to pat myself on the back for letting one go. And it feels good to harvest one and consume something harvested from the woods.

If someone is driving around on their 4 wheeler and sees a grouse. Shuts down their four wheeler. Gets off. Uncases and loads their gun. Walks in the direction of the bird. Then it doesn't have the sense to run, fly or get into cover chances are it isn't going to last long. For that person who is fully in the letter of the law I have no problem with them cleaning out the gene pool a bit and harvesting a bird legally on the ground.

The use of the term "ground pounding" is used with little regard to youth out there interested in grouse hunting.

How many people's first grouse was harvested from the ground via "ground pounding"?

My first grouse was harvested from off a log many years ago. I have very fond memories of it. My 2 oldest kids both shot their first grouse last year. One up in a tree and one from a log. The one who shot the one off the log knew the dog and I were off in another direction. I was not to pleased with him shooting it off the ground at first but held my tongue. Why? Not because I was worried about safety but how it looked. After holding my tongue I remembered how I felt after shooting my first grouse. I felt proud of myself because grouse numbers were down that year. If someone would have come up to me and thrown around the term you "ground pounded" it with all the negative connotation that the term represents I probably wouldn't have developed into a grouse hunter at all. That to me is part of the problem in the hunting community as a whole. To get kids involved we need to understand to gain appreciation for something you have to experience all the different stages of it. Not brought into it being expected to be held on the same playing field as a grown adult who's cut his teeth for 30 years and is at a level the kid can never hope to achieve unless they are let to find things out a bit for themselves.

I am no better because I only shoot them behind my pointing dog on the wing deep in the forest. Just my choice of what I view as being important. That's were I loose a bit of a connection with someone who has little tolerance for others points of view that are out side their realm of understanding so they deem them as ignorant or un ethical. Dennis Anderson to me represents a dividing force between the classes of society of the haves and the have nots in the outdoor community. He puts himself on a higher level than someone who chooses to use a legal piece of equipment to legally hunt a bird. What would you term someone who implies his ideals are better than someone else's because his are more evolved or some how more refined?

He might not like four wheelers.

There are people who view riding a horse as demeaning to the horse. They also view themselves on a higher plane of consciousness than the barbarians who choose to dominate an animal. There are even more who believe any form of hunting is un ethical. Period. Doesn't matter if it's on the wing behind a dog, from a four wheeler or riding a horse to get in position.

[Judge Smails]

Forget throwing rocks to ensure a flight shot. Use that rock to kill the bird and show us how sporting you are.

Do it from a moving ATV for bonus points.

No, wait, I take it back. That would just be silly.

[bottom-bouncer]

this topic is to stupid to really even give much thought to but I will anyway. first Dennis anderson blows. second tyboo you talk about what is and what isnt hunting and what is just shooting thats a pretty big statement for someone to make I personally say get a clue. I am 100% a bow hunter I used to deer hunt with a rifle did so for many years and I then realized that al I had to do was see it to kill it. there are many people out there who are incredible shots just because they can kill a deer at 400yds does that make them any less a hunter. if I sit in my stand for 5 days and johnny do good sits in his for 5 days he shoots his deer 300yds from his stand I shoot mine 20yds from my stand does that mean I am a better hunter or more ethical than him. OR could it be that we choose differnt methods to obtain the same goal.. to harvest the game we are hunting. I am so sick of all the do gooders and L.L bean catolog wanna bees give it a rest.

[bear hunter]

well said bottom-bouncer. i dont care if some out road huning or out on a atv as long as thay are not braking any rules who cares what some one alse douse and anouter one douse.

[Matt Breuer]

Ugh, I've been trying my best to stay out of this one, but I have to chime in... But before I do, is it just me or are there a lot of finger pointers out there these days? This is like the 4th or 5th thread I've replied to this hunting season (not even a month old) where purists or bambi-lovers at heart are cursing out other hunters because they're doing something differently.

Anyway, I've shot a ton of birds on the ground, in trees, and in the air. I've even shot them on a picnic table, and once flying over the teeter-totter in my brothers yard. They all tasted the same, and I had pride in some from each location. To be honest the covey on/around the picnic table was probably one of the most memorable, and probably one of the easiest bouts of shooting of all time. I have a grouse at the taxidermist, it's a giant male in a rare color phase, and I shot it from a log. I was road hunting (yes, on purpose) because my 2 year old asked me if he could go hunting w/ me. I obligued, left the dogs at home teary eyed and upset, and we hit the dusty trails. I shot 3 birds that day, one from the log, one that got up when I shot the one off the log, and one in the woods off the side of the trail. I shot them all legally, and they were all special because it was the first time my son had asked to come with. I didn't mount the bird I plowed from the air because it was sporting, to be honest, I got far less meat from that one than the other 1.

Grouse are my passion, if you know me, or have been to my house, you know how much grouse mean to me. I hunt, eat, or think about grouse 365 days a year. I have a lot of respect for the birds, and I do try to give them a fair shake. 80% of my hunting is done w/ the GSP's. I didn't spend a ton of dough to leave them at home to go ride my ATV around plucking off birds. I hump brush unlike most I encounter in the woods. However, I will take a bird from the trail if I'm in transit from spot to spot. I've also done family ATV rides, or taken my wife wheeling, and have shot birds while doing it. I've also driven past hundreds of them in my time, it all depends on my mood and how I've been shooting that particular day....

To answer an earlier posed question. I do shoot ruffies on the ground, but have only ever shot one pheasant on the ground. It was at a game farm, and the bird refused to get up. I finally got sick of chasing it around the stubble, and I shot it while it was running. I have only water-swatted one duck, again due to refusal to fly. It was a redhead I jumped when I was a wee lad. The thing dove, and dove, and dove. I snuck up on it numerous times, and it refused to go the opposing direction, being up. I finally got tired of it, and popped it off the water. It took me 3 tries, whereas if it had flown, I guarantee I would've piled it on the first shot. Never plucked a bird from the wire, never ground pounded a goose, and absolutely have never even thought about taking a sharptail or hun from the road or shoulder.

I'm no purist, but I'm no rebel either.

If people want to shoot birds while using their ATV from time to time, so be it. I would prefer that it's not their sole means of hunting grouse, and if it is, all I ask is that they leave the forest the way they found it, or even better... You've got a quad, pick up some trash while you're out there, you can carry a hell of a lot more on your quad than I can in my game-bag. Don't rut up the forest floor, and don't flash by me on your Rzr going 50 while you're screaming, "Wahoo".

[uplander]

ATV,s Don't bother me....They drive right past most of the birds anyway...Any bird more than 10 feet off the trail will still be there when me and my setter walk by...and he sticks em! Whirrrrrrrrrrr....Bang ...Oh darn missed again!

[varmithtr]

I'm like a lot of others. I love chasing grouse. I love eating grouse. I really don't enjoy having a 4 wheeler pass me on a non-motorized trail. If the trail is open for motorized use, they have as much of a right to be there as I do. I do agree with the little RZR's or speed machines, they do remind me of a jet ski, but none the less, they still have the right to be there. I would be a proponant of better marking and more non motorized trails, but the guys on the quads should get to enjoy their share of the public land as well. The state woods I like to hunt was posted since last season. In my trip up there opener weekend, I ran into 2 groups of wheelers, and both were on the trails marked for motorized use and both were very respectful. The 2 long trails I walked were both non motorized and I didn't see any machines. My only frustration was that someone beat me to my favorite spot at sunrise. Have to get up earlier!

As far as the how I would take birds, it's simple. Any legal way I can. If I am with dogs, I won't shoot on the ground. If I am not, I won't hesitate one second or try to spook it to fly, or run away. I want that bird. A tree shot as far as I'm concerned is a gift from the bird gods. I can't wait until I eat it. If that isn't your style, more power to you.

[duckbuster]

I have no problem with people hunting/shooting birds from an ATV. In fact I like that the ATV'ers are in the woods packing down the grassy early season trails.

My problem with the ATV is when they no that I am on a trail because my truck is park at the start and they choose to come down a trail already being hunted.

Common courtesy tells you to go to the next trail and come back to this one later in the day. Much of Grouse hunting is ALL about timing anyway.

I'm leaving again tomorrow to take my possesion limit for the 2nd consecutive weekend. GOOD LUCK to those who try to do the same.

[Musky Buck]

The ATV's are why I stopped hunting grouse because I couldn't find better places to go. Get in a mile or two off the road zigzagging the path and finally get close to an old great spot and hear the ATV's coming and I turn around head for the truck and hit the road, just figure there isn't much near the trail now and walking out just bumping into more ATV's with shotguns, it just became a circus too often, I wish I could hunt mid week but I can't, oh well.

[SledNeck]

i like hunting the weekdays much better

[Trashguy]

Ok, a question for you guys on ATV's. You are going down the trail looking for your grouse and see me ahead walking with a cane in one hand and a gun in the other. What do you do, turn around or zip on past me?

[Matt Breuer]

Ok, a question for you guys on ATV's. You are going down the trail looking for your grouse and see me ahead walking with a cane in one hand and a gun in the other. What do you do, turn around or zip on past me?

I'd stop to ask if you needed a ride...

[brittman]

ATV hunters only are looking for the grouse on the trails. While it is irritating to be passed by - I have shot several grouse within minutes of an ATV passing my the dog and I. The grouse was on the edge of the cover.

It is a mind game.

To be honest when walking a long trail both in and out, I always seem to shoot more birds on the hike out.

If you really want to avoid ATVs - get off the trail (with compass) and work edges.

[Chef]

ATV hunters only are looking for the grouse on the trails. While it is irritating to be passed by - I have shot several grouse within minutes of an ATV passing my the dog and I. The grouse was on the edge of the cover.

It is a mind game.

To be honest when walking a long trail both in and out, I always seem to shoot more birds on the hike out.

If you really want to avoid ATVs - get off the trail (with compass) and work edges.

Ridiculous.

Isn't the point of this post the use of ATV's for Grouse hunting? Why should we who opt to walk the trails be forced to crash through the heavy cover (holding a compass???) to avoid ATV's?

How about a simple law to ban their use for Grouse hunting altogether?

[SledNeck]

Ridiculous.

Isn't the point of this post the use of ATV's for Grouse hunting? Why should we who opt to walk the trails be forced to crash through the heavy cover (holding a compass???) to avoid ATV's?

How about a simple law to ban their use for Grouse hunting altogether?

with 2 major atv manuf. in the state I dont think they would allow that to happen

[BoxMN]

I am not as avid grouser as most of you. I do it when not ducking But have spent lots of days in the forests north of Mille Lacs, and must say that the ATV's have ticked me off plenty, especially when I would spend hours walking down some pretty remote trails, and then an ATV comes by me, and a minute later I hear a "pop" and then he comes driving back out. Frustrating, for sure, where it is jealousy or whatever...

But I have also talked to plenty hunters on ATV's and just chatted and had great conversations, so I have nothing against you atv hunters in general. Just that if an ATVer comes down a small trail, and meets a walker, it sure would be nice if they truned aroudn and found another spot. I do that when I am WALKING and come across another group. It would go along ways in PR, IMHO... On bigger roads or well traveled trails, I don't give a rat... Yeah, you can give me a ride back to my truck and I will give you a soda or beer! ha!

[Dave S]

Just remember it's not the ATV that's shooting the grouse. It's not the ATV driving itself down the trails.

There is an individual ontop of that machine who we should be looking at. Not the machine, not a group of people. But an individual.

Thanks to those who've already posted without pointing the blame solely to ATV riders.

[Chef]

I really don't think that would put a major dent in either of their bottom lines, but you're right, politics will prevail.

[dogs]

Matt: your story of taking your kid along, reminds me of once when I had my boy ( 3 years old) with me walking an old trail and I pulled a double on partridge. I looked down at the boy and said what do think of that? ( just a busting my buttons)He replied" I thinks who beats who, superman or spiderman. Pretty muchs put this whole thread in perspective.

[natalie]

Here is my two cents.. I live in Silver Bay and first of all we PROMOTE people coming up with wheelers. We have thousands of mile to travel and your not doing it on foot.. Second, we have trails we walk, we have trails we take our wheeler, and we have trails we take trucks on. It all depends on where you wanna go.

[fishroger]

I think we beat up this subject enough, lets bury it!

[Northdrifter08]

I want a take on the issue of what the 4 wheelers are doing to the trails and habitat..and the ethics of most of the 4 wheelers.... I use to walk a trail N. of Two Harbors (near London Crossing) that was an excellent grouse trail... It had a diverse forest with everything from gravel to clover on the trail... I loved walking the couples miles of trail... Then one fall I arrived to a trail rutted up and no way to walk it anymore... This was part of the State Trail also... I've been back one more time and it was even worse so I have never returned to that trail..

I can't say I have never used a 4 wheeler in hunting grouse but it has been only a few times and I did enjoy walking much better... I did also respect the trails I was on and the other people who were also hunting... If I came upon someone walking a trail I would turn around since they were they're first... This seems to be a common problem among 4 wheeler traffic... They think they own the trails... fly right on by the walker...

I know 4 wheelers are forever going to be used to hunt, and not all of the people who use them are lazy, but I had to put my two cents in...

[Musky Buck]

All I know for sure is my grandfather's with arthritis and other debilitating things just kept walking, maybe not as far each year to year but the experience of the hunt meant most to them, but to each there own, if an ATV gives a person the satisfaction of a good hunt then so be it. Times change. Etc.

[Dave S]

This hasn't been brought up yet, which I'm surprised.

So here's a little FYI to the guys who prefer to walk and have been passed on the trail by "ATV Riders":

ATV Riders must stop and shut down their machine when they encounter "Non-Motorized" trail users until the non-motorized users have passed or are waved on.

So any ATV Rider/Grouse hunter who passes someone on foot without being waved on, is breaking the law. I'm not saying to go out and start a confrontation with these people, but if there is a registration plate on the back of the machine, get the number and submit it to the local CO. Depending on the actions of the ATV Rider, hunter harassment might also be a consideration.

After researching it a little more, it appears that some of the working ahs changed, but they must still yield the right of way to non-motorized trail users.

PAGE 18 TOPIC:TRAIL RIDING Second to the last bullet point.

[BucksnDucks]

Ok heres one for everyone to spin around on now. Whats ur take on the new un-cased law regarding transporting firearms on atv's? I for 1 use an atv to pursue grouse, and feel not one bit bad about it. It is not the only way I hunt them, but as was stated earlier, whats the sense of walking miles and miles of area that are void of grouse. I dont have all the free time in the world to waste on areas of no grouse, so the wheeler helps me harvest birds jus like guys with great dogs, or better knowledge of grouse habitiat. Im not a biologist, jus a guy who likes to hunt. I use the resources that I have available to me. No different the way I see it. I was under the understanding that the reason ppl chose to walk for grouse instead of ride was to get away from the crowds and ppl, but yet there the very same ones who refuse to get off the trail and bust brush, like sum claim they are doing. Kinda hard to have a gripe about a guy putzn down a logging road lookn for a bird, if ur not on the very same trail as he is! All im sayn is theres alot more woods full of grouse than jus where the atv trail leads ya! If ur a walker u should have no problem getn there.

[Augusta]

This hasn't been brought up yet, which I'm surprised.

So here's a little FYI to the guys who prefer to walk and have been passed on the trail by "ATV Riders":

ATV Riders must stop and shut down their machine when they encounter "Non-Motorized" trail users until the non-motorized users have passed or are waved on.

So any ATV Rider/Grouse hunter who passes someone on foot without being waved on, is breaking the law. I'm not saying to go out and start a confrontation with these people, but if there is a registration plate on the back of the machine, get the number and submit it to the local CO. Depending on the actions of the ATV Rider, hunter harassment might also be a consideration.

After researching it a little more, it appears that some of the working ahs changed, but they must still yield the right of way to non-motorized trail users.

PAGE 18 TOPIC:TRAIL RIDING Second to the last bullet point.

Lep, they are referring to "horses" in that segment. An Atv'er does have to yield right of way to a "non motorized" trail user, but only has to shut down or be waved on by a person on a horse.

[Musky Buck]

I am so old school, don't like the noise, don't like the ruts, but have no problem with someone if an ATV is "needed". Our society is so lazy now aday, is that why so many bait illegally, why so many litter the woods and lakes, etc. But, don't worry about me I've quit grouse hunting and everyone in my family has given it up as well, maybe we're just getting lazy.

[Shack]

In the end, no matter if I agree or disagree with something, as long as it is legal and done legally, I have to live with/accept it

Grouse hunting involving an ATV is perfectly legal and I do not see it changing "ever".

(IMO) if anything is unethical, it is this so called outdoors-man's article Just too bad many try and turn fellow sportsman against each other. I think maybe he is moonlighting for PETA? Kind of like a "start at the core" type thing and hope the group separates, which makes it easier to start plucking this and that away.

Yep I agree this topic is dead.