Guests - If You want access to member only forums on FM. You will gain access only when you Sign-in or Sign-Up on Fishing Minnesota.

It's easy - LOOK UPPER right menu.

Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
fishinchicks

Arthritis in lab

25 posts in this topic

We have a yellow lab that is about nine years old. She isn't a hunting dog, but she has been a great rock picking dog. She figured out early that if she went into the fields when we were rock picking, and stood by the rocks, she would get a pat on the head. grin.gif

Unfortunately, she seems to be developing arthritis from all of uneven terrain, and a couple of injuries to her legs while running through the fields. Have any of you had dogs with sore joints, and how have they been treated?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If it's mild sorenes, a crushed up asprin/tylenol/advil/etc can be very effective. I have a 12 year old lab mix with sore joints. My lab really appreciates a good shoulder rub as much as any person would, also.

If it's beyond mild a trip to the vet for better advice may be in order.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Advice I have been given says not to give a dog acetaminophen (tylenol) or ibuprofen (Advil) as it could be harmful. I was told to use only buffered aspirin or childrens aspirin.

I had a retriever that had pretty bad hip dysplasia. When it hurt him he got a crushed up buffered aspirin in a slice of ham. We also had him on a 2X daily dose of Glyco-flex which is much like glucosamine-chondroitin for people with arthritis.

The Glyco-flex really did work for him. He had sore hips starting at 3 yes and he lasted past 10.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have had good results with Prednosone (SP). To get it you would need a vets help. It has done some amazing things but it has some side effects.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a dog with Mild HD and ED.

I have my lab on a Glucosamine + MSM supplements. It helps with the day to day aches and pains.

Could also look into Hyaluronic Acid tablets, I just started my dog on these now also. They are meant for dogs with confirmed arthritis.

Last, I use a Rymadil at times when he looks to be in more pain or sore. Especially after a day or two of hunting. He will get one tablet either that morning or that night.

I have contact information if you are looking for more info on these. Leave you email if you are interested.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for all the replys. I think I will start with the buffered asprin, and see how she responds to that. Hubby came in the house this morning and said the dog wouldn't get up for him, but as soon as my father in law pulled into the yard, she got up and went over to his pickup. grin.gif His pickup coming into the yard is like Pavlov's bell. He always brings her table scraps, and he shares his lunch. grin.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You might also try 500mg of vitamin C I used this with one of my very old labs who refused to stop hunting. On the advise of my vet a tab in the morning and one in the evening worked wonders and is easier on the stomach then aspirin. Also the Vitamin C is flushed through the system, works on humans to grin.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would strongly recommend doing some research (or talking to your vet) on the benefits of Glucosamine for the symptoms your dog has.

The Glusomine/MSM pills I use also include 500 MG of Vit C.

If you want a brand you could look at Cosequin....although it's fairly spendy, but is the only one that has had studies performed specifically on it. I use another brand however.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I recommend glucosamine chondroitin on a daily basis. I find that it is a win/win situation. It presumptively increase fluids in the joints which slows down arthritis (note - it does not stop it) and there are no to very minimal side effects.

If you are going to use aspirin, please consider buffered aspirin. This means that it does not get broken down in the stomach but instead the breakdown occurs in the intestines. This avoids ulcers which can happens with either short or long term use of aspirin.

The other thing that you should be aware of is that the lameness may not be from arthritis. There are multiple tick borne diseases that can cause the signs that you are seeing. Consider seeing your veterinarian to make sure that it is not one of these.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We had her in a couple of years ago when this started, and they couldn't find anything at that time. I have asked Hubby to bring her in to the vet for another check up. (She sleeps with the cats, and I am extremely allergic to the cats and cannot bring her in myself.)

I have seen the glucosamine tablets that are meat flavored. How big are they? She doesn't like dog treats all that much, so I am not sure she would eat them very well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Typically, things change in a couple of years so she could have progressed relative to arthritis, or she could have a tickborne disease or she could have weakness that looks like arthritis. Radiographs (x-rays) and bloodwork may show something. As to the glucosamine, they come in different flavors. Cosequin, restoraflex, etc are but a few of them. You can even try some of the over the counter ones (Costco, walmart, samsclub, target, etc) but be aware that because these are supplements, no one oversees if they are putting in what they say they are putting in. I typically try one of the veterinary ones. If I see a difference then I consider trying one of the ones that are over the counter and if things worsen, I know not to go with that over the counter brand again. The ingredients to look for are glucosamine chondroitin and if MSM is present, that is usually fine. One word of caution is that if your dog has other issues such as diabetes, chronic bladder infections, bladder stones, etc talk to your vet before using these things. They can worsen the other disease process. Hope that helps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:

The ingredients to look for are glucosamine chondroitin and if MSM is present, that is usually fine.


From my understanding (breeders/vets/dr.) MSM is one thing to look for in a supplement (sounds like that is not something you specifically look for?). A few breeders/dr's I know specifically recomend the Glucosomine/MSM/Vit C specifically. "The main reason for MSM is that it is a Sulfur donator and Sulfur is a huge water/lubrication fluid transporter. By increasing fluid transport, that in turn may help reduce pain and inflamation, but it is in a "backdoor" way." I have also heard that the chordroitin is more of a factor in young growing pups (6 months-year) or older dogs that have severe joint issue or have had surgery. Not necessarily worthwhile in 100% healthy dogs.

Also, as vetobe mentioned many of the costco/walmart stores carry many different brands of supplements, none of which are regulated for content or purity......so I personally would not just grab any old bottle off the shelf. You could do as mentioned and test it yourself to see if it is making any difference.

As far as your dog eating them....you will probably need to either put them in something to hide them, or like I do place them as far back in the dogs mouth as you can so they can't spit them back up!!! Makes for a good slobbery hand! tongue.gif

There was a decent article a week ago on MSNBC ddoooottttttttttttt com about joint supplements. It's title is "Arthritis supplements often lack key ingredient" if you want to go to that site and search for it.

P.S. When did the word D0T get on the bad list....it's annoying.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

These three drugs - glucosamine, chondroitin and msm (Methylsulfonylmethane) have a large amount of controversy as to their effectiveness. Most of the research has been done in people but there have been some good animal studies. For glucosamine, a major study came out recently that stated that in mild arthritis, it did not have a great effect but in moderate to severe arthritis, patients showed a significant improvement. As to 311Hemi's statement about chondroitin there was a recent study that showed that it did not do much if anything at all. I am unsure about its use in growing dogs. As to MSM, there is still huge amounts of gaps in our knowledge of how it works and there are huges amounts of claims for what it can do. I am not totally comfortable with the studies that are out so do not tend to push it as an ingredient to my clients. As an aside, chondroitin is typically the most expensive one of the three ingredients - interesting that there is still confusion on whether it does anything or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not to highjack the thread....but Vetobe, have you done any reading on Hyaluronic Acid, either pill forms or injections?

My dog was part of a study at the U of M for HA injections in the elbows, and I have talked to some people who feel the HA in a pill form (not related to the said injection study) can be beneficial for dogs with arthritis. I do not think the study is done at the U of M so I have not heard the results of that study.

The U said HA injections on humans has been beneficial in reducing joint pain, and that is why they are now studying the effects on dogs.

I am sure it falls into the same controversy as mentioned above depending on who you talk to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

hey 311Hemi,

I have done a little reading about HA. Like the other supplements, there is some controversy. HA, when injected into the joint has shown some good results. But, when it is taken orally, the expected positive results have not been seen. In humans, it has shown to cause a significant change but usually this change is shortlived. It is similar to cortisone injections for back issues - it only lasts a short while and then either the inflammation is better or you have to repeat the injection. In most dogs, the inflammation will always be present due to the instability in the joint which causes the pain and the arhtritis. We are trying to make these patients feel better using things where the benefits outweigh the risks (risk of stomach ulcers in long term anti inflammatory use). Usually with these patients, they are receiving multi modal treatment. What I mean by this is that they are on anti inflammatories (rimadyl, metacam, etc), specific diets for both weight loss and their anti inflammatory ingredients, and joint supplements. In most cases, I cannot determine how much each adds to control of pain/inflammation.

How did your pup do with the HA injections? Any improvement? I would think that you may have seen something for a period of time. What else was he/she on or did you have to withdraw from using anything so they could see if the study worked?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Vetobe,

My lab (two years old) has been diagnosed with both ED and mild HD. Both his parents were OFA good on the hips and elbows were good also....I just got one of the small %. Kash was on Glucosomine/MSM/Vit C.

Anyways, we first had surgery on the left elbow because he was limping on it (removed a spur or something from the joint). Surgery seems to have worked because there is no limp anymore. They went into his right elbow but it was fine. They had me take him off all pain meds/supplements before the study.

I really can't tell if the HA injections helped because of the surgery. I did find out he received a placebo in one elbow and the HA in the other...but they would not tell me which ones. They also did multiple gait analysis' after a series of three injections.

It's been over 6 months since his last injection and really hard to say if it did much or not. I think the gait analysis would show the results the best. It would have been easier for me to tell you if the surgery had not been preformed...but it was needed!

I do know that the HA injections were very spendy for the study (obviously I did not have to pay). But the ordinary Joe would could not have afforded to do them every 3-6 months as they may be needed. The hope was that this study would show they were affective and eventually the price would drop as it became a more common practice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

311Hemi

That is the unfortunate thing about OFA certification. There is always the possibility though limited that the pups may not be as good as the parents. I have had some dogs certified as good and they still come back with HD. I still highly recommend it in every breeding dog since we are trying to make the breeds better.

It sounds like you have made a very significant effort to help your pup. There is still research out there that is working on joint cartilage regrowth or new growth. Hopefully it comes to the market in the near future because I know a lot of hunting dogs that would benefit greatly from it.

How is your dog walking now? Stiffness? Pain? Occasional use of anti inflammatories?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:

311Hemi

There is still research out there that is working on joint cartilage regrowth or new growth.

How is your dog walking now? Stiffness? Pain? Occasional use of anti inflammatories?


Do you have more info on the research mentioned above, or is that related to the supplement discussion?

His walking on his front legs is good...no issues. He does usually sit with one foot extended more in front than that other (could be pain related). He does have a sway in the rear, almost looks like he may keep his rear legs straiter than he has to. He does bunny hops and sometimes it almost looks like he skips once in a while when moving around at a slower trot. It might just be how he walks though so I am not sure it of concern. I am going to have a vet look at him either way to make sure he has no other leg issues. He runs full speed without hesitation and jumps around a lot, and climbs up stairs without hesitation. He is a high drive dog and very energetic....so the joint thing is unfortunate.

As far as stiffness/pain, I don't see much. I really only use Rymidyl after full day hunts.....otherwise it's just supplements. I am working on getting some video of him around the yard so I can get feedback from others on if his gait looks odd.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another suggestion regarding HD/arthritis is to lose weight. After being diagnosed w/ medium severity HD, glucosamine supplements and losing some weight (for him it was about 10-12 lbs) worked wonders.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hemi,

I once had a lab with Moderate HD in one hip, kept her weight consistant and swam the heck out of her to keep her muscle mass up and her joint wear down. I believed I used previcox for pain management (only needed it after a long day of pheasant hunting after age 8). I didn't want to go the Rimadyl route as I didn't want to do the liver tests and risk liver damage.

She hunted long days till she died at 10 1/2 form lymphoma. Her hip never gave me an indication of pain. She was either a tough ol' girl or her hip was functioning enough to not show clinical signs of the dysplasia.

On a side note: There is no way of telling 100% if a pup will develop dysplasia based on it's parents screenings. The more generations of clear you can stack, the greater the percentage in reduction of incidents you will recieve. 1 generation is only marginally better than none. 2 generations begins to give you optimism, 3 generations is the minimum I feel gives you a fairly good guarantee of clear hips/elbows/eyes... and the least amount I will except when purchasing a pup or breeding a litter. 4 generations is what I shoot for. With that said, my friend has an eleven month old pup out of a Nationally recognized CH-Master Hunter bred back to a gal dog from one of the most respected Lab breeders in the country. Both dogs carry over 4 generations of clearances and his pup has a "bad wheel". It happens! The dog I spoke of early that was mine was out of my first breeding many years ago... only 2.5 generations on the male's side and my dog plus her grandma on that side... 2 confirmed bad hips in that litter... I ended all breedings from those lines. Back in the 80's their was an accelerated learning curve for dysplasia... we've come along ways in the last 15-20 years!

Good Luck with your dog Hemi... I hope he gives you many more years of service! Hopefully the amount of time and money you've invested pays off in dividends of years of quality service! You know what they say... "Labs are just 3 wheels and a spare"! grin.gif

Good Luck!

Ken

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the info Labs...it gives me hope I wont have to retire him early!! The Rimadyl is used sparingly and mainly only during hunting season.

And I agree on the parent screening part of it! Kash has 4 or 5 generations of clearances (can't remember which, it might even be 6), is from a bigger breeder, and still had issue. A friend of mine has his brother who is in perfect condition. Sound similar to your friends situation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

311Hemi,

There are a few ongoing studies into joint regrowth especially in labradors. There is also ongoing research into horses and joint cartilage regrowth. These studies are still in immaturity so I do not want you to get your hopes up. My statement previously was more of a broad statement about cartilage regrowth and the things that it may promise in the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Vetobe...I understand 100%. I was just looking to read more about what types of things they are doing, don't worry about getting my hopes up!

The next big thing I really want too see is a test for EIC (hopefully the U study is successful in doing that in the next few years), the joint regrowth would be great if it ends up workinig out!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

exercise induced collapse is another very interesting disease. Have only seen a few of these but they scare me since their temperature spike and they have a chance of dying if they go to far. Research is definitely needed. I have to believe that this is a completely genetic trait and if we can isolate the genes that are causing it, we can test for it and eliminate it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:

I have to believe that this is a completely genetic trait and if we can isolate the genes that are causing it


Thats the sounds of it.

Here is the last update from Jan. 2007:

Hi everyone,

It's been a while since I've posted. I wanted to let you all know, thanks to the help of the many who have already donated samples, that we are VERY close to determing the gene that is responsible for EIC. We have narrowed our search down to a small segment of a single chromosome (dogs have 38 ). We've also obtained additional funding from the AKC to follow up on this area. All data so far indicates that we are in the right area, and additional sample have only served to verify that we are indeed in the right spot. Alas, the area is quite gene dense, so we have a lot of candidates to sift through.

At this time, we would be quite interested in obtaining additional affected FAMILIES of labs (mom, dad, and affected and unaffected sibs), as well as samples from other breeds that appear to have the same condition. These samples would serve to help us determine if there was a single founder.

Just thought you'd like to hear the good news. Hopefully we'll have more to follow sooner rather than later.

Katie Minor, RN

University of Minnesota

Canine Genomics Lab

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0



  • Posts

    • ANYFISH2
      sure odd to see the timberwolves mentioned in trade possibilities with the likes of a Kyrie Irving.
    • ANYFISH2
      I just dont believe that to be a Esox bite at all. Too much space between the Major wounds, IMHO!
    • delcecchi
      That is a strong possibility...
    • Hoey
      Here is a photo of the foot.  Looks like a toothy gator.  
    • BringAnExtension
      http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2017/07/21/fish-injury-island-lake/   DULUTH, Minn. (AP) — An 11-year-old girl has undergone surgery to repair damage to her foot which might have been caused by a fish in a northeastern Minnesota lake. Maren Kesselhon suffered nine deep lacerations and tendon damage when she was injured while sitting on a paddleboard on Island Lake north of Duluth Wednesday. Maren’s dad, Ryan Kesselhorn, says his daughter told him she could feel her foot in the mouth of a fish and kicked at it with her other foot to free herself. The Dickinson Press reports doctors at Essentia Health, where Maren had surgery, say the razor-sharp cuts, some down to the bone, probably were caused by a fish. Island Lake is home to large muskies and northern pike. A Duluth fisherman caught and released a 47-inch long muskie Wednesday.
    • RoosterMan
      Captain Acorn, I fish Jiggin Raps quite a bit on Vermilion, have for several years now.  I Cast em, fish them vertical and move around and cover ground at a good pace with them.  I am not sure there is any key to getting snagged less, other than knowing your spots. They are certainly an effective and a great way to catch fish.  I personally do not remove either the front or the back hook.  Believe me if you fish these your going to donate a few to the depths, just part of the game.    Good luck! - Roosterman
    • Rick
      Walleye fishing on Mille Lacs Lake will remain closed until Aug. 11 to protect the walleye fishery, and ensure its long-term health and sustainability into the future To extend the walleye fishing season through Labor Day, the state will allow for an additional 11,000 pounds of walleye harvest on Mille Lacs New solutions are being sought to rebuild and sustain a healthy Mille Lacs walleye fishery New fisheries data collected by the Minnesota Department of Natural Resources show the total safe harvest allocation for walleyes on Mille Lacs Lake (44,800 pounds) has already been exceeded this season. To protect the fishery and ensure the long-term sustainability of Mille Lacs Lake’s walleye population, the DNR announced today that walleye fishing will remain closed until Friday, Aug. 11. In order to extend the walleye fishing season through Labor Day, the state will allow for an additional 11,000 pounds of walleye harvest. Catch-and-release walleye fishing will run from Friday, Aug. 11, through Monday, Sept. 4, for the Labor Day weekend. Walleye fishing will then be closed from Tuesday, Sept. 5, through Thursday, Nov. 30. As these regulation changes were announced, Minnesota DNR Commissioner Tom Landwehr reiterated the state’s commitment to rebuilding and sustaining a healthy walleye fishery in Mille Lacs Lake. “Improving the walleye population in Mille Lacs is a top priority for the DNR,” Landwehr said. “We deeply regret the hardships these new regulations will cause for anglers and business owners. But they are essential to protect and enhance the future of walleye fishing in the lake for future generations. We will continue doing everything we can to understand the challenges facing the walleye fishery, and take whatever actions we can to resolve this very difficult situation.” Landwehr and DNR fisheries chief Don Pereira noted that allowing for additional catch-and-release fishing in August is essential for area anglers, businesses, and Mille Lacs area communities. The decision to allow for this additional harvest was made with input from the Mille Lacs Fisheries Advisory Committee. “We want to allow as much walleye fishing on Mille Lacs as possible,” Pereira said. “So even though state anglers already have caught their quota of fish, the DNR will dip into the allowed conservation overage to reopen the season on Aug. 11.” Through the closure, anglers on Mille Lacs Lake may fish for all other species in the lake including bass, muskellunge and northern pike. When fishing for other species, only artificial baits and lures will be allowed in possession, except for anglers targeting northern pike or muskie, who may fish with sucker minnows longer than 8 inches. A prohibition on night fishing will remain in place from 10 p.m. to 6 a.m. through Nov. 30. However, anglers may fish for muskie and northern pike at night, but may only use artificial lures longer than 8 inches or sucker minnows longer than 8 inches. Bowfishing for rough fish also is allowed at night but possession of angling equipment is not allowed and only rough fish may be in possession. Understanding walleye fishing quotas on Mille Lacs this year, and why that quota was reached earlier than predicted
      The DNR and the Chippewa bands that cooperatively manage Mille Lacs Lake agreed this year to harvest quotas of 44,800 pounds for state anglers and 19,200 pounds for tribal fishing. They also agreed that up to 75,000 pounds of walleye could be harvested from the lake from Dec. 1, 2016 to Nov. 30, 2017. That agreement allows the state to use a built-in buffer – the 11,000 pounds difference between the 75,000 pounds conservation cap and the 64,000 pounds combined harvest quotas – in an attempt to allow catch-and-release walleye fishing through Labor Day, following the mid-summer closure. Bi-weekly creel surveys show that state anglers already have reached their quota. “The DNR is using its full allotment to maximize opportunities to fish for walleye on Mille Lacs without violating our agreement,” Pereira said. “The DNR, just like area businesses, would greatly prefer to not have fishing restrictions in place. But sustaining and stabilizing Mille Lacs’ walleye population is our primary obligation and public responsibility.” Continuing the walleye fishing closure will reduce the number of fish that die after being caught and released, a condition known as hooking mortality. The likelihood of fish suffering hooking mortality increases as water temperatures warm. High walleye catch rates on Mille Lacs have increased DNR fishing projections. A hot walleye bite attracted more anglers to the lake, resulting in angler effort that is about double what it was in 2016. “Cooler than normal temperatures kept hooking mortality rates low, but more anglers fished Mille Lacs, particularly catching walleye longer than 20 inches,” Pereira said. “That increased the poundage of fish caught and put us over our walleye quota.” According to the DNR, bigger fish are biting, in part, because there is a shortage of food for larger walleye. Last fall’s assessment showed that larger walleye were thinner than average. Mille Lacs’ hot bite also reflects the findings of studies done in many other fisheries that show catchability actually increases when fish population drops. In Mille Lacs, walleye congregate in preferred spots rather than disperse evenly throughout the lake. Fewer fish in the lake means there is more room in the preferred spots for fish to gather, creating a situation where a larger percentage of the population is in position to be caught rather than gathering in a less preferred but less fished area. More information about Mille Lacs Lake, the regulation adjustments and management of the fishery is available on the DNR website at www.mndnr.gov/millelacslake. New solutions are being sought to improve and sustain a healthy walleye fishery
      The DNR announced in June that a new external review team of scientists will take a fresh look at Mille Lacs Lake’s walleye fishery, using all of the best science available to gain a better understanding of the lake. This new review, led by walleye expert Dr. Chris Vandergoot of the U.S. Geological Survey, will provide additional recommendations to improve fisheries management of the lake, and contribute to a long-term solution to improving and sustaining a healthy walleye fishery for future generations. The group’s report is expected in time to help guide and inform fisheries management decisions for the 2018 season. DNR encourages Minnesotans to fish for other abundant species on Mille Lacs Lake
      As today’s walleye fishing regulation changes were announced, the DNR encouraged all Minnesotans to visit Mille Lacs Lake to fish the other abundant species that the lake has to offer. Mille Lacs Lake’s other opportunities for top-notch fishing will not be affected by the regulation adjustment. Bassmaster Magazine named Mille Lacs the nation’s best bass lake in June and will send 50 of the country’s best anglers to the lake In September for its Angler of the Year tournament. Northern pike abound in Mille Lacs, along with muskellunge. In early July, a woman from southern Minnesota caught and released in Mille Lacs what may have been Minnesota’s largest-ever muskellunge. To learn more about Mille Lacs Lake and its many great fishing opportunities, visit the DNR website. To plan visit to the Mille Lacs area, visit the Mille Lacs Area Tourism Council website. Discuss below - to view set the hook here.
    • Rick
      Q: What is happening with the walleye season this summer on Mille Lacs Lake? A: The closure that began July 8 and was set to end July 28 is being extended by two weeks. That means walleye fishing will reopen at 6:01 a.m. on Aug. 11 for catch-and-release only through Labor Day. A night fishing closure also will remain in place from 10 p.m. to 6 a.m. through Nov. 30. Q: How does this affect fishing for other species? A: Fishing regulations for other species such as smallmouth bass, muskie and northern pike remain the same. During the night closure, there is an exception for muskie and northern pike anglers using artificial lures and sucker minnows longer than 8 inches. Q: Why did the DNR extend the closure? A: While the DNR wants to allow as much walleye fishing on Mille Lacs as possible, the state is also required to abide by cooperative agreements made with eight American Indian Chippewa bands. The two weeks of additional closure allows the state to abide by a harvest quota set earlier this year with the bands. The DNR and the bands agreed to harvest quotas of 44,800 pounds for state anglers and 19,200 pounds for tribal fishing. They also agreed that up to 75,000 pounds of walleye could be sustainably harvested from the lake from Dec. 1, 2016 to Nov. 30, 2017 in order to conserve the population That agreement allows the state to use a built-in buffer – the 11,000 pounds difference between the conservation cap of 75,000 pounds and the combined harvest quota of 64,000 pounds – in an attempt to allow catch-and-release walleye fishing through Labor Day, following the mid-summer closure. The latest creel survey data shows that state anglers reached their quota of 44,800 pounds of walleye caught from Mille Lacs in early July. Even though state anglers already have caught their quota of fish, the DNR is dipping into the allowed conservation reserve in order to reopen the season on Aug. 11. Q: Why has the walleye population in Mille Lacs declined? What is the DNR doing in the long-term to try to conserve the population? A: The vast majority of walleye that hatch do not survive to their third autumn in the lake. Walleye numbers have declined to the point that it has become important to protect spawning-sized walleye, particularly the class of walleye that hatched in 2013. It is important to protect the large 2013 year class to replenish aging spawning stock. Most males from the 2013 class are now mature, but females will not start to contribute in large numbers until next spring. The state is committed to conserving the population of walleyes born in 2013 to improve and rebuild a sustainable population for the future. Q: Why do we count hooking mortality during a closed walleye season? A: The amount that state anglers can kill (as spelled out in state-bands agreements) also must include fish that die as a result of hooking mortality, the fish that die after being caught and then released back into the water. During the closure, some anglers still catch walleye incidentally and some of those fish die after being released. Under the state-band agreements, those dead fish must be calculated and counted against the state’s allocation. Q: How did this cooperative management between the state and the bands of Mille Lacs Lake come to be? A: Recall that in 1999, the U.S. Supreme Court upheld lower-court decisions that allowed the Mille Lacs band and seven other Chippewa bands to exercise off-reservation fishing and hunting rights. The lower federal court also set up guidelines, known as stipulations and protocols, for both sides to follow. These stipulations and protocols provide a framework for how the bands and the state must work cooperatively to manage shared natural resources, including Mille Lacs fish. In their agreements, the DNR and the bands are required to annually establish the number of walleye that can safely be harvested from Mille Lacs while ensuring sufficient remaining walleye in the lake for a healthy fishery. Q: If the walleye population is in decline, why are anglers catching so many? A: Fish are biting for two reasons. First, there is a shortage of food for larger walleye. Last fall’s assessment showed that larger walleye were thinner than average. Second, studies in many fisheries show that catchability actually increases when fish population decline. In Mille Lacs, walleye congregate in preferred spots rather than disperse evenly throughout the lake. Fewer fish in the lake means there’s more room in the preferred spots for fish to gather, and anglers find these spots where they can catch a larger portion of fish. Finally, while the walleye population has decreased considerably (by half or more), the amount of fishing pressure has declined by a lot more. This means that there are more walleye per angler fishing Mille Lacs today. Q: How is the DNR using science and research to help the walleye population? A: Mille Lacs Lake is the most studied lake in Minnesota. It is also a complex and changing system. The agency conducts a large number of surveys on the lake annually. These surveys include assessing the abundance of young walleye; setting 52 nets to assess adult abundance; using fine-mesh nets each summer to determine abundance of food (prey fish) for walleye; and using interviews with anglers around the lake (called creel surveys) to estimate the number of fish anglers are catching. The DNR also periodically tags walleye and other species to provide actual population estimates. We are tagging bass this year in cooperation with angling groups, and will be tagging walleye in 2018 and 2019 when the 2013 year class will be reaching full maturity. Q: What is the purpose of the external review the DNR has initiated? A: The DNR has asked Dr. Chris Vandergoot to lead an independent review of the DNR’s scientific approaches to manage Mille Lacs Lake. Vandergoot is a key member of the international team that co-manages a very significant walleye fishery in Lake Erie. He works for the U.S. Geological Survey in the Sandusky Lake Erie Biological station in Ohio. His review report will be available to the public in early 2018 and will help inform fisheries management decisions for the 2018 season. Q: What does the future look like for Mille Lacs walleye? A: It is unlikely that Mille Lacs walleye production will return to the levels that state anglers enjoyed over 20 years ago. The ecosystem of Mille Lacs is going through extreme change, starting with increased water clarity in the mid-1990s, to impacts today from aquatic invasive species such as spiny water flea and zebra mussels. Longer growing seasons are also helping some species such as smallmouth bass but may be hurting others. While walleye will still be abundant, the future fishery will be more diverse, offering angling opportunities for a greater variety of fish. Discuss below - to view set the hook here.
    • bucketmouth64
      Thanks for the suggestions. I believe I'll be going with the 150 hp. My next question is trolling motor, 24/36 volt? I have a 24 volt now with a MK maxxum. I would like to get the MK Ultrex, but that has a 80lb thrust and the 36 volt comes at 112 lb. Is there a noticeable difference between the two? I noticed they come in ipilot and ipilot link. What's the difference? Not sure if I would utilize ipilot since I don't walleye fish. I use the trolling motor a lot while fishing.
    • guideman
      Maybe you need some new spots. Raised 9 fish last night in 3 hours. Hooked two boated one.   "Ace" "It's just fishing man"