Trespassing

[eye1000us]

Having spent alot of time on deer stands lately and having had to deal with tresspassers the last couple of years I'm wondering what it will take to get tresspassing taken care of. I do not own the property I hunt on and have worked at creating a relationship with a land owner who is nice enough to allow me to hunt at will on his property.I post the property and am given the duty to keep others off who don't belong there. I have had to tell people to leave several times in the last couple of years as has the land owner.This is not a fun chore and may not always be a safe one ( cell phones do not work in this area and a trip to reception is at least 45min away on foot which makes it too late ).To a certain segment of the population there is no such thing land they can't hunt or venture on to posted or not.The fear of a $50 fine or whatever small amount it is does not seem to be a deterent in the least.My personal belief is that we are no where tough enough on people that do get caught and its time for the state to step up and make tresspassing convictions something very undesirable.

My ideas would run along the lines of first offense $1000 and you lose your hunting/fishing privileges for 1 year ,second offense $2000/2 years third offense $10000/10 years and any subsequent conviction results in a lifetime ban.Any other ideas? Other than shoot,shovel and shutup

Sorry for rambling a bit.Too many hours on stand with time to think ( and stew a bit)

[harvey lee]

WE at one time had a real problem with the same.Here is what we have done in the last 7-10 years and it is working.

We post everything 3 times better than is required by ND law.Anytime we see someone that thinks about tresspassing we tell them to leave in a polite way and also tell them that the next time they will be turned over to the law and we take down thier vechile license.If we see someone again the law is called and charges are pressed.The word must have gotten out as we rarely have any problems anymore.And yes,we are near a bigger city,Fargo.

I am not saying that this will work for you,but it sure did for us and is still getting the job done.Be polite and let them know what will happen and inforce it if it does.

[chucker34]

Agree with Harvey Lee.

In your case, I would honestly, and I am not trying to be a jerk, get NO HUNTING signs made up in the native language of these individuals and put them right next to the ones in English. This way, they will clearly understand if they don't speak English and have no arguements to the contrary. I'm sure with a little research you could do this yourself and would show the CO how much effort you've went through to prevent trespassing so they will enforce the current law without hesitation. I know its too long of a down time until they'd get there from when you could call them, but if its a recurring problem, the CO would probably love to come out there and sit and wait one Saturday to write up some violations other than ones for buring barrels.

[primetime49]

Tresspassing is not a major problem where we are,probaly because it is given a lot of attention by local enforcemant and neighbors.Thus community I live in were the ones that got the defination of most alnd is private.If it even looks like graging,farming ,crp,tree starts ,or is within 550 feet of buildings,tou ahd best give it a close look and talk to owner before going on it.You cant imagine how quick a phone rings around here if someone looks out of place on neighbors property etc.Most neighbors probaly also have right to wander for game.We got the bill sent thru legislature so fast and so well defined that it is very easy to have a ticket written.But in home area farms are so defined that it may be much different than areas that have no definition in landscape.We also have the smallest percentage of public property of 98% countys in the greater USA.Its hard to know that there may be 50 other persons looking to hunt property you would like to be on.But most are doing it with respect.how do you guys do it where countys,state etc have large portions of land.You must really hvae to post,or is it working just relying on others to be good sports?

[harvey lee]

Where we hunt in ND,there is 3 miles of fence that abut the Sheyenne National Grasslands and we post the heck out of it. People use to cut the chain and lock on the gates but as we have caught some and pressed charges the word has gotten out that no one will get away with it if they are caught.

We also have a card program that works like this.

If I give you permission to hunt the deer season,then you recieve a card that states your name and the year you are allowed to be on the property.This card is also coded so no one else can make a copy. Now,when the renters are there daily checking cattle and crops and they see someone on the property,they best have a card or the cops are called.

This seems like it is taking it to the extreme but it is done very easy and works great.

[tealitup]

I own about 250 ac. of land up north which has one neighbor - the rest is landlocked by Superior National Forest. Our driveway is 1.5 miles long. Have a do not tresspass and private road sign, but every year people drive up and break into our hunting shack. We have stopped putting a lock on the door because it just gets shot off.

This year there was shotgun shells all over the ground from people hunting grouse.

About 10 years ago we had a cable style gate and a snowmobile driver hit the cable going pretty fast. It took his head off. I believe his riding partners were charged with tresspassing and DUI. But now we are afraid of putting another gate up because of the past. We are thinking of putting up a large cattle type gate fence up this summer but we have been debating this. Its getting to the point that nothing is safe - treestands, pots and pans, stove - even the cover to the well was broke off.

[doser]

You never answered my e-mails Harvey Lee

[harvey lee]

Doser

Please send those again as I have been having problems with my e-mail.Some days good and today problems again.

[BLACKJACK]

Leaving it open for people to drive up is asking for trouble and vadalism, I'd put up the cattle style gate, and also side fences so they can't drive around it. If they have to walk the 1.5 miles, it would keep out 80% of the rifraff. Then I'd spend the time and money to post it every 50 yards, with clear lettering that TRESSPASSERS WILL BE PROSECUTED. Then prosecute a few, the word will get out.

[chris63]

Im going to get roasted but here goes,1000,2000 ,10000 bucks for trespassing ?Seems a little harsh to me.c63

[BLACKJACK]

It might be harsh if its a mistake, but if the land is very well posted and you knowingly trespass, be prepared to face the consequences. And in this guys case, its probably locals doing the damage, hit a few of them with a stiff fine, the word gets around, the kids doing it grow older and wiser, problem solved.

[Deitz Dittrich]

C63- try telling that to someone who paid $50,000+ for land to call their own.

[chucker34]

Agree with Deitz. Sucks to put all the money, time, and effort into getting things right for the season and have some bozos blow it for you.

Think of it this way. What if someone broke into your house and trashed it? Wouldn't you be a little teed off? Wouldn't you want them to face some stern legal penalties? It's pretty much the same thing.

That said, I think I'd keep the penalty for the first time offense relatively minor, though, with a stern warning of the next offense, be it $1,000+ and confiscation of weapon, etc. I think that way, you're not penalizing the honest guys who made a mistake or the ones who are pretty harmless and will get the message of what's to come.

But no matter how harsh you make the penalties, I doubt it would be effective in stopping those true poachers/criminals/etc. It's like drunk driving. Just because you take their license and car away, doesn't mean somone who has a problem won't get another car or borrow one and get on the road again - license or no license. If someone's intent on doing it, they'll find a way around it. If they're sneaky and intelligent enough, they can keep their criminal activities undercover, especially if they don't register their deer and process it themselves, etc.

Your best bet is to minimize their activity on your land by letting them know you're watching and so is the CO. They'll probably move on to an easier and less conspicuous target, which is sad that it will happen to some other guy, but you have to look out for yourself - as does he.

[McGurk]

You can get a half a dozen trail cams for less than 1% of your investment, and they very well may pay themselves off if you can prosecute. Just make sure you have them hidden better than just strapping them to a tree; the only thing that needs to be exposed is the lens and flash. Even though the flash is a dead giveaway there are pictures being taken, they are in the field of view and are being photographed while they scramble and/or look for the camera.

Sux that we have to talk this way, though. Just pray that your golden getaway doesn't get used as a smash and grab meth lab. Ruins the cabin and the land, let alone the people it's being sold to.

[harvey lee]

Another issue is the liability end of it. Someone is hunting on your land and he hurts himself,then what. In todays world everyone is sue happy. Why put yourself in that sinking boat.

[tealitup]

We thought we were going to get sued by the snowmobiliers family (the one who had his head taken off) but nothing came about. Our road used to be very hard to drive on (alot of boulders and mud) but with ATV's its easy.

I am sure it is locals that go up there and play; our neighbor, who goes up there monthly, looks after the place when he is there. Even fixed our outhouse after someone pushed it over.

We have contacted the local CO and asked him to drive up to just take a look when he can; but we are in the middle of a national forest so local state CO's do not visit the area too often.

The state also demanded access from our driveway this winter so that they can log some trees out of the area. They said if we put a gate up it most likely will be taken down. I do not understand this since we own, with our neighbor, the driveway and no one has an easement. I think this will get more people going in and out of our property - so we will have to put a gate up as soon as possible.

Last bear hunting season (my first and the first bear hunt on the land in 50+ years) I found a manmade trail off the driveway. Well it turned out that a local guide was using our land to bait bear and charging people $3500+ to hunt. He would drop off his clients on the road and drive out. I found one of the clients in a very nice portable stand one evening.

I just do not understand the "respect" factor of some people now-a-days. My family has owned this property for over 75 years.

[nitrokfa]

this post is to chuckar. posting land in different languages, are you kidding me? this is still America. if you cant read or speak english you should still be able to be prosecuted. there is no reason to take the time or money to put out the NO TRESSPASSING signs in 50 different languages.

[chucker34]

Nitrokfa, I didn't say putting them out in a bunch of languages. I said in the native language the majority of the offenders speak. Sure, I'd rather they speak English, but if they don't, I'd want to make sure they understand for my sake, regardless.

Believe me, I'm the last guy to say we should translate everything into 50 languages. I am a firm believer that the language is the cornerstone of a society, which is why it frustrates me when people move here and haven't learned the fundamentals of English within several years. No other country in the world would tolerate it much less help you out by translating everything in 50 languages.

People who argue for the use of so many languages here and against instituting a common national language cry out our country was founded on diversity. No it wasn't. It was founded by a diverse group of immigrants, who moved here and adopted a new common way of life. They managed to find a way to retain their heritage and customs, etc., while establishing a new identity as an American and learning the language. Okay, I'm off my soapbox.

[CAJ]

I also have a small farm in North Dakota. I have never posted my land. If I have problem with hunters, it is the ones that own land and post it, and hunt all over everybody land next to them. Most of the hunter problems are my closest neighbors. CAJ

[primetime49]

Blackjack you have the right thought going,put up a gate.You know at the pheasant farm when I got rid of it and still took care of it for new guys that couldnt be around all the time that a gate went up.Also posted all the way around @2 total miles with fence posts and new signs.At first the ones that couldnt figure out what the gate was for drove around it.Up by Timber lake you see that they were tired of getting gate ran over so they put radistor cracking styled spikes 3 feet long on it.I did the trail cam deal so I know exactly who was going around gate,Yes I knew every vehicle pictured.Out of the hundreds of hunters and trap shooters that went out before they all respected the gate.It was and is neighbors still coming and going and a couple of people who have done some work for us before.10 years ago when I got really tired of getting out to lake or one of farms to hunt and either finding people in my stands or having them walk in not noticing we were alredy there I wrote about it in my Cabin Fever Paper that went out to about 10,000 homes per issue.Than I got Al Juhnke to put bill together for us landowners stating we no longer had to post any property that even looks like farmland CRP woodstart or was within550 feet of buildings This bill passed so quick and now gets something like 6 or 7 pages in hunting and some notice even in fishing regulations booklet.We were already putting on a big banquet each year to feed and entertain landowners that allowed shared sporting and sportsmen filled with gear and also legislators ,congressmen and Dnr.All the quetions you had or any ideas you would have were getting audience from the best possible persons available.We also brought in children from schools,and votech so they could get a glimpse of not only the outdoors but politics.We did this 3 years at civic center and one at Prairie woods.It worked but isnt done anymore.It probaly took 125 people each year at civic center but we thanked 200 to 400 property owners per year for hunting land sharing and definatly informed hundreds more on how to ask permission properly .And the ones without land got to meet landowners from the several county area.Fond memories,things such as Crep,crp,public access etc did benifit from this.Your right gates and information and yes get the DNR to write and enforce tickets.Hunting rights should be the first way of dealing with penalty not money.

[primetime49]

tealit up I cant imagine that someone put a paying party on land without permission.Maybe if you talk to the guide and get that $3500.and start a good property management program.I would be sure that they wouldnt argue if you mentioned this.But put up the cattle style gate and yes they may take it down.Talk to local snowmobile enforcement and rider clubs and explain this violation.The clubs sometimes can support watching this gate for you if you are out of area to enhance a good image of all snowmobilers.

[tealitup]

Yea, I could not imagine it either. Property management.. what do you mean?

The client was not too happy at the guide - hope he got his money back.

[MNMAV93]

i have a farm is SE iowa and have trouble with spotlighters. we have mowed paths around the edge of the timber and they seem to just go wherever they want to. i hope that they will stop soon....hopefully

[HavocTec]

Yes seems this is a big problem everywhere. I hunt a quarter of river bottom land that my Wifes Grand father owns. This land is four miles North of Cyrus. I bow hunted this land all season and seen tons of pheasants on it. So yesterday I went out to what I thought was gunna be a good hunt. We parked on the South end and walked North and back South around the catails, til we got to the river then crossed and walked a strip of grass to the North on that side. Well as we were walking that a black hatch back car drives out of the pit.(there is a small gravel pit there). Well we were too far from the truck to chase him down and no binoks so we just watched him drive away like a mad man.Anyway back to the hunt, we seen tons of hens and 2 roosters. So if anyone happends to see this car and gets the plate number, and they get this guy I will hand out a reward. Its time to use the buddy system here and help each other out. I seen they were doing this with ice houses and thought it could work here as well. Thanks for reading.