Labs4Me

[Eric Wettschreck]

Dude,

Only a month and a half left of rooster season. Even less than that for me if we get decent ice sooner.

boilerguy_1 at yahoo (Contact Us Please). Drop me a line, we need to shoot some roost-af-ahas and drink some ice cold and just plain gosh darn tastey pabst blue ribbon.

[LABS4ME]

We are close to being done at work... maybe one more week... then onto a months worth of hunting... Let's get something done the 1st half of December... I'll e-mail you, that's the best time to hunt them long-tails anyways!!!! Plus the Pabst never gets warm

Good Luck!

Ken

[eagle_3464]

After muzzleloader season I will have time for birds. Being without a dog tends to make these birds difficult. Can I come too??? Please, please, please... Maybe you can give me some tips on what to look for in a dog too.

[Eric Wettschreck]

Dude, I don't have a hunting dog either. Never stopped me before.

[eagle_3464]

I try to squeeze in what I can but the archery season cuts heavily into the bird season. I know we can still hunt without the dogs but it sure would make it easier to find downed birds. Plus its just enjoyable watching a good dog work.

[Eric Wettschreck]

Agreed. Absolutely.

I've hunted over some really nice dogs and had a blast.

[LABS4ME]

B.G. That don't look like no cat in your avatar! Eagle as long as it's O.K. with B.G. it's good with me.

And Now... for the rest of the story! I have a 12 1/2 year old and 11 year old lab... hopefully the wheels don't come off before this (maybe their last) trip. I may also have my 11 month old along, who has yet to experience the flush of a cock bird... but SD is only 2-3 weeks away and I'm sure she will see plenty of them there! If the bolts and baling twine hold the two old dogs together, we will be able to put up and pick-up some birds... they're grizzled old veterans from days gone by when I actually made time to hunt!

Good Luck!

Ken

[Eric Wettschreck]

The more the merrier.

That's no cat but he darn sure chases cats. Actually I've hunted over him and he hunts very well. If nothing else he sure covers a lot of ground real real real real fast. However, because I'm a terrible person and bad dog owner he doens't listen very well. Sooooooooooooooooo, when I hunt with him I have to tie a lead line to him and hold on to it.

If I'm alone this is very difficult. If other fellers come with me I have no problem leaving the shotgun in the truck and handling Jeffrey for the other fellas. Understand, he weights about 110 pounds so handling him without a gun is the safe way to go.

I do have a 11 year old lab cross. Her heart wants to go, but the legs just won't let her. I'd take her anyway but after about 20 seconds she's done.

Weekend of Dec 2 is bad for me cuz I'm on call. Weekend of Dec 9 or Dec 16 is awesome.

[eagle_3464]

Where are you guys going to be chasing the roosters? I am in the Tracy area with lots of WMA's in the surrounding area. I'm sure the birds are well into the running stage with all the pressure they have been getting. Hopefully I have at least one more deer by mid-December.

[LABS4ME]

We'll have to ask the "guide"!

Good Luck!

Ken

[eagle_3464]

Labs, I have seen other have asked you for advice about dogs so I was wondering if you are a breeder or just very knowledgable about labs. I was thinking of getting a yellow or fox red lab, preferably a pointing retriever. Whats your opinion about them?

[LABS4ME]

Boy this has the potential to be a long post... yellow and 'fox red' are one in the same. Both are just plain old yellow labs. Don't let the marketing hype make you believe you are getting some other kind of lab. Ivorys, snow whites, fox reds, british reds, etc. are all yellows, no ifs ands or buts.

With that said, choosing a reputable breeder, that is breeding quality stock is your most important hurdle in choosing a lab. It should be the #1 aspect of picking a pup. The amount of inherited disorders that are being bred into labs is unreal. Along with that are breeders taking in zero consideration for the true labrador physical traits. They were bred the way the standard dictates for a reason, but so many are now snipey, long legged, wirey coated dogs that in no way fit into the labrador mold. As I've pointed out many times, how often did you see a lab wearing a neoprene vest 15 years ago?

Once you have found a breeder that you trust, you can worry about color and if it is out of pointing stock or not. Just because you are buying from proven pointing stock in no way insures that you will end up with a pointing lab. It definitley tilts the odds in your favor, but guarantees nothing. I have also owned two labs that came from no known pointing lines that were tremendous pointers. I have never, nor never will train one to point. If it is in their blood and they naturally take to it, so be it, but if they are as they were bred, strong flushers, that works for me as well. I take what the dog gives me.

This is just generalizations and a quick guideline, if you need more specifics let me know, I'll do my best to answer them, either here or if you go hunting with us.

Good luck!

Ken

[eagle_3464]

Thanks for the great information, I'm sure I'll have more questions later. I do understand that they are all basically yellow labs. I was referring more to the tone of color in any particular dog. I am interested in a lab because I would like to both waterfowl and pheasant. A pointer because I think it is great hunting with them. You never said whether or not you are a breeder and/or trainer?

[LABS4ME]

I still do a very limited amount of breeding. I do not have one planned as I type. I have a client with a 4 year-old offspring of one of my last litters who is QAA and has a couple of pups left to sell. I used to be an 'on the side' trainer, but have since gotten out of that. With my job, I'm lucky if I have enough time to devote to my own dogs. I ran trials for a couple of years and ran and judged hunt tests for around 8 years almost full time. Been with labs 2o years and have had the pleasure of putting my hand over close to 2 dozen in that time. Some better, some worse, all were fun.

Again the varying tones of the yellow coat have no correlation as to the final outcome of your dog. It's just varying shades of hair color, no different than humans... although I think a 'natural' yellow shade of hair in humans is real hard to come by! It is only personal preference as to which you desire. Some like them light, some like them dark... It's funny how the whims of puppy buyers change when a 'new' name is given to a varying shade color and they become in vogue. 15 years ago it was hard to sell a reddish colored pup, but then someone came up with 'fox red' and they were all the rage. Now someone came out with British Reds and they go for many hundreds more than a similar dog or even litter mate with a different shade of coat. 20 years ago no one wanted the light yellows as they showed to much dirt, but alas; Ivorys and Snow Whites came out and they were impossible to breed fast enough. Too many people buying pups based on color as their first criteria, is promoting indiscriminate breeding for 'color' as the first and most essential priority of the breeding. Choose your breeder and pup wisely as it is a long committment once the transaction is complete.

Good Luck!

Ken

[Bryce]

Come on Lab's. Just tell them to get one of them pretty chocolates and they're all set Jezebel has worked out better than Greg let on. Give me a call when the season is done. Maybe do a pheasant hunt if time allows but definitly need some landscaping advice on the new digs.

[Ray Esboldt]

Heck, Bryce even sold me one them black labs that no one seems to like anymore. And, despite my best efforts to botch up her training, she's turning into a very good hunting dog. But, even better, she's more obedient and well mannered than I could have ever hoped for. Thanks, Bryce. I would recommend one of Jez's pups in a heartbeat. Plus, Diamond really looks forward to having more nieces and nephews.

[Eric Wettschreck]

Guide??? Didja just call me a guide???

I've been called a lot of different things in my life, but never guide.

We can go where ever yous guys want. Yes, birdies are getting freaked out and getting up way in front. All this means is you have to hunt smart. Slamming truck doors, yelling at dogs, talking loud to each other is a sure fire way to not get a shot off all day.

[eagle_3464]

Someone has to be the guide so there is someone to blame if there are no birds :-) But just think all the praise you get if there are birds...

Ken, thanks for your knowledge and willingness to share. I've heard a breeder that gets his breeding stock from England and people claim they are so good. I'm not sure I buy that other than the hype that they originate from England. Is there anything special about breeding stock from there or basically the same as any good breeder around here?

[LABS4ME]

British dogs tend to be calmer, more tractible dogs than their American couterparts. The only hesitation I have of the British dogs is that their hip and elbow registry is years behind America's... I'm considering a British import for my next Lab. I bred to a direct Scottish import 3 litters ago and really liked the outcome. I have a lot of interaction with to of the progeny. You do need to train them different than American dogs, but they remind me more of what we had with our labs in the 70's and 80's both physically and their attitude/personality.

Good Luck!

Ken

[Eric Wettschreck]

I can live without praise, but if you need someone to blame go ahead and hit me, I have big shoulders.

Should we get into a bird or 2, yous guys can praise yourselves and buy me a Pabst.

[Bryce]

Ray, we've moved if you haven't heard. Lot's of room for the doggies to run down here in Shakopee. Contact us about bringing Diamond down for a romp this winter. Melissa just loves to see her puppies all grown up.

[Ray Esboldt]

Bryce,

I did hear that you moved. And, Lord knows Diamond would be up for that. I'll have to try to get that arranged. Heck, maybe we can just invite ourselves down to Boilerguy's area in December with Labs.

[eagle_3464]

Bryce, do you breed any labs with the yellow to red colors? Last spring I inquired about some red colored labs from someone near you in Savage. I've got the name and number somewhere but do you know anything about them. I have also had my eye on a web site for Sauk River labs. Has anyone heard anything about them. Quality web site, just wondering if the same is in the dogs they breed. Their top stud dog is an offspring of "Raider".

[Eric Wettschreck]

C'mon down. You know the area. We'll be hunting in Dougs back yard!!!!

Prolly a good chance we'll be tippin an ice cold and gosh darn tastey pabst at the local pub, too.

[Ray Esboldt]

BG,

I'll be down there Monday and Tuesday. If you see an extended cab red '99 F-150 with an 8 foot box, start honking and swerving at me. I'll pullover for a chat.

[Eric Wettschreck]

I'll be in the Avoca pub Monday night watching the football game on the new BIG SCREEN TV!!!!!!!

If ya walk in and see a flat out gosh darn handsome guy drinking pabst........it aint me. However, the other dude you see drinking PBR will be me. Swing through and I'll buy ya one. If you're hanging out with Doug bring him with. Mrs. Boilerguy and he know each other real well. She works for the newspaper.

[Ray Esboldt]

We'll do.

[skinnylee]

BG LET ME KNOW IF YOU HAVE ROOM FOR ONE MORE SOMETIME WHEN YOU GET TOGETHER I THINK I CAN FIND AVOCA FROM HERE I CAN BRING ONE DOG LATER SKINNYLEE

[Bryce]

Ray, always up for a hunt but Dec. is pretty much committed to SoDak... if I ever get laid off.

Eagle, no yellows. Only pretty chocolates with a few blacks. While my dogs will "lock up" on birds momentarily, I haven't pushed the point issue. Can't say that I'm overly impressed with the looks of dogs being produced by breeders of pointing labs. Have seen a lot of chatter about the Sauk breeder. Nothing bad to say about them in that chatter.

[Ray Esboldt]

Bryce,

Does Jezebel do a momentary lock on birds? Diamond does the same thing, especially when she circles back on a bird. It's pretty cool. Unfortunately, every time she has done it a hen jumps up or I whiff on a rooster. I have no desire or know how on how to develop it, but it sure is fun to see. It must be in their blood.