Superior Angling Endorsement

[WxGuy]

I hear there's a proposal in the works to replace the MN Trout and Salmon stamp in a select area of Lake Superior.

Quoted from the Western Lake Superior Trolling Association:

"The purpose of the Lake Superior Fishing and Angling Endorsement is to replace the Trout and Salmon Stamp

and establish an appropriate and stable funding source for the management of the Lake Superior and St. Louis

River waters, watersheds, rivers and streams up to the first natural or man made barriers."

Thoughts?

[backcast]

This will be in addition to the trout endorsement for those who chose to fish in certain waters (Lake Superior, St. Louis River and the rivers and streams which flow into Lake Superior up to the designated barrier.

The money raised would be used toward the above mentioned watershed. The best way to find out more information and to be informed is to go to www.wlsta.org and can either "click" on the topic under the title WEEKLY FISHING REPORT, or "click" onto "WHAT'S NEW" on the Left hand side.

I think that it is much needed and will greatly improve this specific body of water in many areas.

[Surface Tension]

I'm still digesting the info from the Lake Superior management Plan. BTW how much did that cost us?

I'm looking at this as yet another user fee. It amazing we ever had a stocking program (BS) before stamps. Yes I'm skeptical, its not that I don't believe funding for LS should come directly from the user group but lets face it, most trout guys will end up buying both stamps. Anyway lets back up to the Management Plan. Was I imagining this or didn't our DNR recommend the Chinook program should and will end and didn't I read that lake trout goals have been meet in parts of the lake. So why the need for more money or am I'm making an assumption this new stamp is to better fund programs directly. Since our current stamp funded these projects shouldn't that stamps fees be lowered to reflect the extra funding created by the new stamp? Sorry, I've seen this before from our DNR, the new trail sticker for example.

[moderation]

Many years ago, back with the Lake Superior Steelhead Association, we had the same type of thing come up to us, and it might have been the currant trout stamp. At that time they wanted support from our group but we did not give it to them because a big part of the money would go into the general fund. Nobody really had a problem with the stamp, as long as the money went back into the fisheries, but when they take fishermans money and give to other areas it shouldn’t fly.

Hopefully this is not the case, and if an increase does go in, it should all go for our fisheries.

[SKIPPERS KID]

Well here we go again as a charter boat capt. on the lake I think they are full of poop. All they rais at french river is loopers and suckers to feed muskey ponds this might be good to rais suckers for that but they could rais them in a farm pond. The next thing you will have to have is a stamp for every lake you fish. they need some one to look at there books and see firs hand where the dallers are going I don't mind spending monney when i know where it is going and if it is for stalking of fish in the big lake fine but not for raising suckers. I think they should plant salmon but now they said its done well the stamp i have says trout and salmon well they should remove that salmon and reduce the price of the stamp since they are not stalking them why should we pay far not stalking salmon where it that extra money going?????

[Casaloma]

Lets do some good for our city with this new Tax ( if not next year it's coming to a day where we will have a LS stamp ). We could close down the Aquarium & design it as the primer great lakes trout hatchery. Any one with a LS Stamp could visit for free! I would visit that more often than I have been in the current building.

Solving Duluth's problems... One fish at a time.

Later -CLoma

[cashcrews]

The Superior Endorsement is currently a proposal that has been drafted by the Western Lake Superior Trolling Association (WLSTA). It is for consideration at this point. The idea behind it, is that all revenues generated would go directly into a Lake Superior fisheries management fund. If anything went into the general fund, the WLSTA would not support it.

Cashcrews

[OUTDOORNUT]

Is the WSLTA a non-profit? If so, I think there has to be some kind of grants out there for various projects. (Salmon stocking, invasive species, etc.) Although I don't mind spending more $$ for the fisheries, an additional montary abligation to fish is getting a tad out of hand. The Trout stamp seems to go up every year, along with the actual fishing license itself.

What do the Charter guys think of this? So now everyone that wants to take a once a year trip out needs a MN license, a MN Trout Stamp, and also a Superior Angling Endorsement??

[Viking]

If this goes into effect, I think I will pass on the Minnesota stamp, and fish the cheesey water only. They do increase the price of the trout stamp each year, and should look more at how the current funds are being handled.

[trico]

Quote:

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They do increase the price of the trout stamp each year, and should look more at how the current funds are being handled.

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While I think many areas of outdoor management need to be carefully examined, especially in an era of decreasing funds, your statement about raising the trout stamp every year is completely false.

Has it been raised steadily over the past ten years? Yes. Point to me a license or a stamp that also hasn't risen as well.

If you don't want to pay a few extra dollars so that more money can be raised for a resource, what does that say about how you truly feel about it? Frankly, I think our licenses and stamps are too low. Consider the bang for the buck a year long fishing license gives you. Could you find that kind of entertainment for that price elsewhere?

Sportsman constantly complain about wanting this and wanting that. Consider we may have to shell out a few extra bucks along the way to help achieve those wants.

D.A.

[OUTDOORNUT]

Quote:

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Quote:

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Sportsman constantly complain about wanting this and wanting that. Consider we may have to shell out a few extra bucks along the way to help achieve those wants.

D.A.

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Does it need to go up, maybe, but does the system need to be more efficient?? Absolutely!

Let be honest, the Gov't couldn't run a paper route without losing it's butt!

I think what a lot of guys are saying is; They charge more and more, but we are seeing less and less. Where is the $$ going? How about the portion of Lotto cash that is suppose to go to the DNR, what percentage of this is actually making it into the ground (or water) for that matter?

[End of the Line]

If I understand this correctly you would not need a trout stamp to fish Lake Superior. Just the endorsement. Trying to change when money is spent for fishing Lake Superior vs. a trout stream in SE MN so we can accurately assess the difference and get those funds where they are intended.

For all of you not happy with the current MN DNR plan, as I am, where were you when the meetings were being held at the EPA building last month etc..? Could have used more support. I am in favor of this new endorsement.

[DEADhead]

I agree with trico...

[Viking]

After reading the proposal, and understanding that you would not need the trout salmon stamp. I too would be in favor of this. I fish the Minnesota side very seldom, but purchase the family license for both Minnesota and Wisconsin along with the stamps every year.

[cashcrews]

End of the Line is correct: If you only fish Lake Superior, you would only need the Endorsement. It would not be necessary to have a regular trout stamp. If you also fish inland lakes and streams, then you'd need both.

Read the proposal if you can spare a few moments. The WLSTA is a non-profit, and as recreational anglers many of the groups members have become concerned that Lake Superior is not receiving the attention it deserves (as the Greatest Lake.) This proposal, if implemented, would dedicate a fund to Lake Superior fisheries management, and other things like access improvements on the lake and St. Louis River.

[Viking]

A few other ways dollars could be raised, 1$ for everytime you fish, 1$ for every fish caught, I just feel that between the 2 state licenses I purchase, I pay top dollar already for the number of times I fish, and the number of fish I take.

[Riverratpete]

Why is it whenever someone questions the validitity of spending more money on a "User Fee" people are always more than willing to question that persons conviction/passion about their sport/recreation/school as if your not willing to just hand over your wallet to every nut job idea than you obviously don't care about your sport/recreation/child/community, etc. I think the legitamite question is "Where is the money going"? not "You obviously don't care". I'd pay for an Endorsement no problem as long as the money got put into LS watershed and I didn't have to have statewide also since I do the majority of my trout fishing on the north shore.

[Viking]

Well put Riverratpete. I just mailed a $10 check to join the WLSTA, because I wanted to. Not because I had to.

[End of the Line]

I tried to get the Moderators of this forum to post this info more than a week ago so you could voice your concerns. I suggest ALL of your concerns and questions should be sent to [email protected]. or better yet [email protected] Capt Dave is the WLSTA president and the one working on the change.

[ReelTimes]

It appears that the end result of the WLSTA Plan would be more $$ allocated toward the management of Lake Superior, and that should be a positive if used wisely. If you read the DNR Plan, you will note that the DNR already feels that they spend a disproportionate amount of dollars on the big lake. We can all, of course, debate their numbers. Also, while you may not have attended the meeting, it is still not too late to send your comments regarding the DNR Plan to the DNR. You have until January 15th. If you haven't read the Plan and you have an interest in the big lake, you should do so. If implemented, they will no longer stock chinook in Lake Superior. They're basing their recommendations on a low chinook return rate to the French. Personally, I do not believe that is necessarily the best measure for evaluating program success. Many of these fish may return to other rivers that are better suited (canadian and other streams). Anecdotally, I think most folks I talk to who fish LS feel the chinook fishery has improved vastly over the past 10-15 years. Again, not from a shore fishing perspective but for those who fish the open waters.

[Fly Guy]

I would be in favor of such action only if it was not being added to the general fund. I would also guess that if this were to go through Wisconsin would develop a similar stamp. Our fisheries need this money, especially for restoration (habitat and species) and enforcement. Accountability is important (how the money is spent)but from most of the DNR staff I have talked with informally feel they are understaffed and underfunded for the work that needs to be done.

[OUTDOORNUT]

Joel & cashcrews,

Thanks for your insight and help, I ask a lot of questions about the WLSTA because I don't know much about them and I think they are missing a huge opportunity to be the Leaders in the fight for change, but also for future progress. The WLSTA website doesn't give the reader much for what they actually do. (at least any sort of breakdown of where the money is going)

From the website:

With a strong foundation of heritage and purpose for being, the Western Lake Superior Trolling Association quickly grew in membership and supporters. Concerns on how best to develop, nurture and protect the developing fishery were all high priorities with the people making up the organization. A diverse and healthy fish community became very important and all that encompassed the fishery.

Directions were requested and taken by the Western Lake Superior Trolling Association's governing body. Those directions came from the membership and supporters and were structured into an organizational working position and the by - laws.

Those positions are as follows:

To monitor laws and regulations to ensure fairness and applicability,

To insure adequate launch and harboring facilities.

Monitoring water quality to preserve our resource.

Promoting the association of sport fishing people in every way possible

Educating the public on safe and effective boating and fishing methods

Most of those objectives seem to cost little or NOTHING to do. Please take my babble as positive criticism. I hope the WLSTA prospers and I'll even join, but I haven't been convinced it is worthy yet. When I ask around on the street most of the responses are that it is an association for the Charter Captains and doesn't come off as too "Recreational Fisherman" friendly.

Like this listed position: "To ensure adequate launch and harboring facilities"

I don't know if anyone noticed, but the Western Lake Superior launch facilities aren't exactly worth noting. (Garfield Landing, that little broken dock @ Knife River landing, one fishing cleaning station (Silver Bay) Now if the WLSTA wanted to attract some new members what would be better than a sign listing the launch site improvements though the effort of the WLSTA? And it could mostly be done with grant money and matching funds. (memberships & Jaw Derby $$) http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/grants/water/lake_superior.html

This is just one of the many, the WLSTA could invest into their own or a joint effort of Salmon Stocking. I know the Apostle Island group has done some stocking, maybe a model or maybe a chance to work together?

Why wasn't the WLSTA using media outlets, flyers, etc. for the Lake Superior Management meeting? The website seems to more of an informational provider and I think in order to get things done is through grass root efforts. We are all going to have to get our hands dirty, but maybe that isn't the way the WLSTA wants to go and that is what I want to know..... before I am going donate.

[End of the Line]

Flyguy,

Wisconsin already has an inland trout stamp and the Great Lakes stamp separated already.

[Surface Tension]

This goes way beyond funding. Its an issue of interests, DNR vs WLSTA.

I wish we could have world class Chinook fishery on Superior but the lake can't support it. Superior is a Lake Trout lake with best Lake Trout water of all the great lakes. Although I believe you can alter most studies to support your beliefs, the WLS Management Plan goes into detail about the relationship of Chinooks and Superiors native and exotic fish. Still its my opinion that Superior could still have a limited Chinook program, a program adjusted accordingly to smelt numbers.

The way I see it, the big push behind this Endorsement is WLSTA would like a foot in the door as to how the Lake is managed.

"The Minnesota legislature will establish a Lake Superior Fishing and Angling Endorsement Fund Over Sight

Committee with the authority to review the Lake Superior Fishing and Angling Endorsement Fund, make recommendations

for the funds use and oversee the fishing and boating laws and regulation and suggest appropriate

ideas and changes when necessary pertaining to the Lake Superior waters below the first natural or

man made barrier. The committee will be established with a minimum of two local legislators, one (1) from the

Senate and one (1) from the House of Representative with the option of additional legislative representation

and a minimum of five (5) local and appropriately licensed Lake Superior fishing and angling persons with no

present or past state or federal government employee or conflict of interest possibilities. The Minnesota Department

of Natural Resources personnel responsible for the Lake Superior fishery and enforcement will act

as advisors and provide requested information for committee review and consideration. The Lake Superior

Fishing and Angling Endorsement Fund Over Sight Committee will meet in a Legislative District 6A or 6B location."

As you can see this proposal wants control of funding out of the DNR's control an onto an oversite commitee. This commitee, like you, would be in favor of a Chinook program. Chinooks are a huge customer draw for charters and recreational anglers. I'm not saying WLSTA's only agenda here is keeping a Chinook program but its a very important issue.

[Viking]

I know some of the people on this board charter on the lake. I know nothing about the charter industry there and have no intention of getting into it. I will remain a fair weather fisherman but would like to find out a little more information on the business. I would like to hear from both the Minnesota and Wisconsin side. What kind of fees do you pay to make a living on the lake ? I know there is some sort of license that needs to be renewed every year, do any of these funds go into Lake Superior management ? you sell sell fishing licenses to clients. Does this money go only for lake Superior management ? I have never been on a charter, so I have no idea. Now a question a little off base, but for the Minnesota Charter captains that come out the Duluth entry, is there a fee or toll for lifting the bridge ? that would maybe go into some sort of general fund for repairs and maintaining the bridge ?

I wish the states and countries bordering the lake could somehow come together to manage this resource with some sort of joint effort.

[Big Country]

I use to be a member and can tell you first hand that they have studied all facets concerning Lake Superior. Their newsletter has covered issues such as the Mcquade harbor access, lamprey control issues, steelhead reports and updates, coastal water brookies, the kamloop program and yes, chinook's. I felt they have been a pretty informative crew. Could they do more about getting things done? That's a personal opinion. Everybody has a certain agenda and I'm sure they have theirs. BC

[Viking]

I should have added commercial fishing into the last post also.

[cashcrews]

I've been a member of WLSTA for a little over a year now, and I was elected to the WLSTA Board of Directors about 8 months ago. Being that I am still relatively new to the group, I cannot yet speak with confidence for the actions of the group in years past. I do know that they have been active, mostly through their newsletter, in keeping members apprised of numerous situations affecting Lake Superior fishing. The WLSTA has regularly had board members that sit on committees that interact with resource managers. The group is open to anyone with an interest in fishing Lake Superior. We do have a number of members who are Charter Captains, but the overwhelming majority of our membership is the recreational fisherman.

Regarding the Lake Superior Endorsement Proposal:

We do not want people thinking they would have to buy both the Trout and Salmon Stamp and pay extra for the Endorsement to fish Lake Superior and the St. Louis. Lake Superior and the St. Louis would be the endorsement and the other Minnesota trout waters, the Trout and Salmon Stamp.

Another thing to remember is that the moneys generated from the Endorsement would go back directly for the Lake Superior and St. Louis Estuary.

This endorsement effort is an angler driven idea/suggestion and not an effort by the Minnesota DNR.

Back to the WLSTA: We are planning several events for 2006. You have already heard about our proposal for the Lake Superior Endorsement. We will be interested to see the comments from FM members, and others who care to let us know their opinions on the matter. Even if the proposal does not come to fruition, I think it will be useful in generating some important conversations and information sharing about the status and direction of the Lake Superior fishery. WLSTA also is planning a Lake Superior Fishing Seminar to take place in early March. Advertisements will go out soon to area businesses, and we will let you know about it on this forum as soon as we have things finalized with our planning. Of course, we also have the annual JAWS Derby; and our general membership meetings which are held each month will often have speakers with good information about the fishing on Lake Superior and some of the political and other issues affecting the lake.

Speaking of meetings: We will have our next general membership meeting on Wednesday, January 18, 7PM at the Duluth Labor Temple - 2001 London Road in Duluth. Don Schreiner, DNR Lake Superior area fisheries supervisor will be present to discuss the Lake Superior Management Plan and take questions. All are welcome to attend.

Cashcrews

[End of the Line]

I have to pay for an annual commercial fishing license of $125 to MNDNR to run a charter in MN. No toll for the bridge, its a city function. The other thing to note is that alot of the captains sell 24 hour licenses on the boat for customers. Paper tickets; we want that money too since that is specifically being used on that day on Lake Superior. Those sell for $9.50 each. Just to give you an example I personally sold over 120 licenses last season. That doesnt include the ones that other bought before they came down to the boat. If the endorsement plan goes through I'll make sure to tell clients to buy them on my boat vs the other places.

[backcast]

One of the things I have witnessed through being a member of the WLSTA, NSCCA and also with this forum, is the incredible amount of wisdom and talent among all of you.

What is the common denominator? Is it just the catching of fish, or is it the passion of wanting something better then we have, not only for ourselves, but for those who are to come after us?

In the time of cost cuts, politics and personal agendas, a unified group is a very strong influence compared to one voice alone.

By having a diverse number of individuals in a group, each and everyone has something to contribute from their prospective and it is of value. The end result may not be what you personally had thought or planned, but your imput could lead to something even better.

As was mentioned earlier, there is a WLSTA general meeting coming up on January 18th.