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Cove

ideal fishing rig

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Cove

I am gettting back into boat/motor ownership after several years off. Alot has happened with outboards in particular.
I am trying to tap into information particularily on outboards. Have a friend with a 75 Suzuki who is thrilled with it but the local Lund boat dealer I prefer carries only Evinrude, Johnson and Yamaha.
I am likely to get a Pro V 1775 and an outboard in the 70-80 hp range that is maximally quiet, reliable and fuel /emmissions efficient.

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Beckman

The Evinrude and Suzuki are the same motors. I've heard good things about them. The 80 Yammie is also a very popular motor although I've heard that they don't recommend prolonged trolling with them, I guess it damages the motor somehow.

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Grabs

Also, a 75 or 80HP motor on a 1775 Pro-V? Seems to me that you might have a hard time moving that rig once you get it loaded.

As mentioned before don't go less than 80% of the max rated HP.

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Beckman

I'm assuming this is a tiller. The 1775 is only rated for a 80hp tiller. If it is a wheel you're looking at then I agree that you should go with more power.

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Grabs

Good point Beckman, and yes the tiller is only rated to 80HP, but let me ask this,..is the tiller any lighter or shorter than the steering model SE? Is the rating only because they don't want anyone handling that much power by hand? Seems to me that with an 80hp on the same size boat tiller or steered, it might be tough to get on plane.

Can someone explain the differences between the motor ratings of a tiller vs. steered models?

Thanks

------------------
fisherman2.gif

[This message has been edited by Grabs (edited 08-05-2002).]

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Beckman

I think that it is the same hull on the 1775 for both the tiller and the console. So it's basically the same boat except for a little added weight of the console. I've seen this boat with an 80 hp Yamaha, 75 Merc and 70hp Suzuki/Evinrude and none were underpowered. A friend of mine tried a 60 and this was way underpowered so he traded it for a 75.

I've wondered about hp ratings myself so I did some research and I posted the formula which the boat manufacturers must follow below. I guess the difference with tillers must be handling and safety concerns. Note that boats over 20' don't apply to this formula, that's why Warrior can get away with their 175 tiller on the 2090.

The formula that boat builders follow is from the American Boat and Yacht Council's book "Standards and Recommended Practices for Small Craft". The formula is as follows:
ABYC H-26 Powering of Boats
This is in compliance of USCG regulations as stated in Title 33, CFR, Part 183, Subpart D.
Horsepower calculations
Remote steering and at least 20" transom
LOA X Beam in decimal feet = ________factor
Factor____x 2=_____-90=_____horsepower factor
Tiller steering boats with at least 20" transom
LOA X Beam in decimal feet =______factor
Factor____X .8=_____-25=_______horsepower factor
Example: Warrior V193 DC-E LOA 19'3" Beam 97"
19.25 x 8.08 = 155.54 x 2 = 311.08 - 90 = 221.08
221.08 is the horsepower factor. The boat can be rated for 225 hp as explained in the following standard: ABYC 26.6.1.2.4 If the hp capacity as computed above is not a multiple of 5, it may be raised to the next multiple of 5.
ABYC 26.6.2 The maximum power capacity for boats 20' or more in length, recommended for use with outboard motors, shall be determined by the manufacturer and stated on the power capacity plate.

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LundExplorer

The basis for the lower rating on a tiller would be the fact that the weight of the driver plus the weight of the motor is more concentrated at the stern where it is more evenly distributed in a remote steer boat. I don't think it has much to do with the capability of the boat to go 20 mph vs 90 mph but more to do with water going over the transom

TL

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Grabs

Ok this is all well and good, and makes perfect sense. But common sense tells me that the weight of the motor plus the weight of the driver towards the back of the boat would make it that much harder for this boat to get on plane, and being worse as the boat got longer, causing it harder to see above the bow.

Is there anyone in here that has a boat similar to this? Do they add extra weight to the bow to help get it on plane?

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Slugo

I have a Crestliner Pro Am with a 75 hp Mariner. it is max rated at a 80hp. It planes out and moves along fine. Even with buddies and gear. tho there are days I'd like to see a few more poneys heheh course I'd always like that...just the way I am.
One thing you will want for sure is a trim control. so you can trim as you go, that will increase the boats performance and save the hell out of your arm!!!!

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LundExplorer

Grabs, Yes we have this problem even with a 16' Lund SSV and a 25hp tiller (the boat is rated for a 30hp) especially on windy days. The solution: Gas tank in front of the middle seat and a concrete block in front.

I would not consider this being "not up on plane" but rather "too much up on plane". Also, lets say I put a 50hp on this boat. I would be more concerned with cutting the throttle hard and the resulting wave over the stern as it would be overloaded in back.

Probably not as big a deal on a 95 degree and sunny day as on a 25 degree, 30 mph wind and snow day just before freeze-up.

;-)

TL

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LundExplorer

One more thing, I agree with Grabs on not going lower than 80% of the max rating, all too many rigs sold at boat shows are underpowered "deals" the dealers are getting rid of. A lot of these rigs show up on the used boat market just a few years later... or at least the motor does...

TL

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Beckman

The 1775 Pro V is not a huge boat, 17' 3" and weighs 1200 pounds. The 70 Suzuki gets it on plane just fine, the 80 Yamaha is a little better and with a typical load and full tank of gas you'll top out at about 35 mph.

With all this being said, there are advantages to staying with a good old 2-stroke: better performance, lighter weight, and less $$$.

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Cove

Thanks for all the input.
Beckman, what did you mean about Evinrude and Suzuki being the same motors? I thought Bombadier bought out OMC and did alot of work on the Fitch fuel injection systems & didn't think Suzuki was one of those deals where they change the nameplate and a few cosmetics but I would like to believe it because my friend was so impressed with his Suzuki.

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Cove

As to engine size. I decided to break all the rules in 1992 when I bought a Smokercraft, then the Fazor 192 which was a BIG aluminum rig, 18' 10" long and wide as well. Rated for 175. I had a 2 year old Evinrude 60 that I decided to keep on there the first year and I ended up using it from 92 till '99 when I sold the rig. I could get up well enough and run at mid to upper 20s. The big deal was that at the time (mid 90's) all the bigger outboards could not troll down slow enough without all sorts of contraptions. Plus, the fuel consumption was good enough that with the 27 gallon tank I could get quite a range.
That boat weighed about as much as the 1775 Pro V.
Which is the quietest, most reliable, easiest to start and run...those are the keys.

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Beckman

It is the identical powerhead on the Suzuki and Evinrude 4 strokes. The fict is different.

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WallEYES

COVE
I have a new 1800 prov with the 90 suzuki tiller...maximum rating for the boat. Suzuki uses evenrude lower units on their motors while the powerhead is the multiport fuel injection made by suzuki. I think this is the best 4 stroke motor ou there right now and the quietest. I had a 60 hp on an 1990 pro v that I sold out right and picked up my new one. There is no difference between the 60 and 70 suzuki motor except a few rpms and dollars...stay with the 60. The 90hp is the biggest in the tiller model, becuse susuki has not developed a tiller handle yet fot the bigger than 90hp. Bigger models are the 115hp and this year the 140hp came out. With a six year warranty, sometimes offering that, from top to bottom this motor is well worth it. Not too many dealers carry suzuki, the two that I know of is Frankies bait and marine in chisago and dans southside marine in bloomington. Nobody has mentioned the pitch of the prop in here for planing out...with the proper pitched prop and auto trim can get any boat to plane out no problem...no different than a plane.

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Cove

Thanks, you guys.
There is a Suzuki dealer just north of Rochester but only sells Alumacraft boats.
The Lund dealer here in Rochester doesn't carry Suzuki. I have always thought it best to buy the whole rig from one place but will have to think long about this. The Suzuki sounds good. I wish there was some objective consumer review on the main choices.

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waterwolff

Cove.
I now fish out of pro v 1775 with a 75 Merc 2 stroke tiller and it will run 31-33 wot and I have no problem starting it in the late fall or early spring one thing you might want to consider is the serviceability of the motor should you have a problem while on a trip I have to belive there are a lot more evinrude merc dealers out there than say honda yamaha suski dealers but the biggest drawback to the two stroke is the smoke so all that said I guess I would lean towards the T80 yamaha

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Cove

Waterwolf,
It really helps to hear from actual owners of the boat I am strongly leaning towards.
The Evinrude web site has a stat sheet on the Evinrude 90 and 115 on the 1775 but not on the "smaller" outboards. I am disposed to getting smaller as long as it performs well and for me 31 mph is flying.

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Thomas

you will be more happy with a boat that goes around 40 mph.

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vikes40for60

Cove,

Speed is relative. My new boat goes 35 compared to 19 in my older boat. That is fast enough for me. However, in 2 years I am sure I will want 40+. smile.gif

Pick a motor that fits your budget and your fishing techniques.

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mrmillelacs

i bought the 1775 last year with the four stroke f80 yamaha. i have trolled for several hours with no problems. It has plenty of power i can get 42 mph gps with a little trim at 5600 rpm. it doesnt seem to me that it takes any longer to get to plane, but it does seem to take a couple more miles per hour to keep it on plane, i have nevr regreted choosing the tiller model except when it rains.. lol

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