New Regs?

[CaptainMusky]

Clown that supports my point on this whole new management strategy as well. Nice post.

Supports exactly what I said. 12% hooking mortality, a guy catches 40 fish if he releases them all on avg he may have killed 5 fish. While the meat hoarder may kill 2 provided it was a more open reg on harvest (is not 18 to 20).

[Red Miller]

One observation: I am getting a kick out this perception that is getting painted in this thread;

People who fish the lake and keep fish to eat = meat hoarder = bad

People who fish the lake and release fish (and kill some for no reason)= C&R = good

People who fish the lake to put money in their bank accounts = what??

[maxpower17]

I missed one.

4. Poor ethics and taking limits has ruined the balance in the lake even though the limits have been reduced to 1/3. If not reduced limits, it's probably all the lawbreakers.

To be honest, I believe it's the REDUCTION in harvest that has been the major contributor to the imbalance.

Each ecosystem has a certain biomass. Regardless of the distribution of the species, the biomass will remain relatively level depending on certain environmental factors. In general, relatively level.

Regardless of how much you take from that ecosystem, it will be replaced in some way by more biomass as long as you aren't greatly upsetting other pieces of the ecosystem puzzle.

Say you protect one only large walleyes, something has to give. Food is going to suffer and somehow the ecosystem will need to compensate. When you start messing with all the other pieces of the puzzle to fix one piece, you risk moving farther in the wrong direction.

I say, hooking mortality helps kill off some of the harmful biomass and makes room for the desirable biomass. I say the meat hunters after large walleyes are helping.

The fact that there are only small perch left is a massive clue. The small perch are compensating for the small walleyes missing from the lake. The smallmouth are also compensating for this imbalance. You're finding smallies and pike where they never used to be. Why? Because there is food for them there in the absence of the smaller walleyes.

I don't claim to be a biologist, but it makes sense to me.

[CaptainMusky]

Max there is a lot of examples to support what you are saying. The most prevalent one being red lake and the crappie boom. Walleyes gone things fell in place for crappies to explode. Granted that was probably a perfect storm but I think it totally supports what you say.

Eventually the over abundance of large walleyes will work its way out because those fish will die and are not being filled from beneath by a tremendous young group so it could get worse before it gets better but in 10 or even 5 years the lake could be 180 degrees different.

[river rat316]

And there are no walleye lakes on hwy 47 from st.francis to isle.

Green, Ann, Lory, Knife, Lewis, all have eyes in them, the Rum river is probably a better eye fishery than all of them, and Mille Lacs ,if eaters are what you want and you pass right over that also.

[Bandersnatch]

Just a quick note on the term Meat Hunters for the posts out there that have to call someone a name in a lame attempt to make a point.

"Meat Hunters" wouldn't go to a lake with a two fish limit in the first place.

[maxpower17]

Just a quick note on the term Meat Hunters for the posts out there that have to call someone a name in a lame attempt to make a point.

"Meat Hunters" wouldn't go to a lake with a two fish limit in the first place.

I think you missed the point. Meat hunters are being blamed for the conservative limits and state of the lake.

[Alagnak]

Just a quick note on the term Meat Hunters for the posts out there that have to call someone a name in a lame attempt to make a point.

"Meat Hunters" wouldn't go to a lake with a two fish limit in the first place.

'Real' meat hunters don't care about limits anyway- just catching and killing.

[Kyhl]

"Meat Hunters" wouldn't go to a lake with a two fish limit in the first place.

Then what are we debating? I personally don't care that there are no "eater" size fish in any lake because I only keep four to five fish a year, total.

Seems it takes two to debate. In this case, those looking for "eaters" and those that aren't. I'm not bent out of shape because I can't feed my family out of ML. There clearly are some here that are disapointed that they can't feed their families ML walleyes. I'm saying that they are the ones that need to look in the mirror to find the cause of the decline instead of blaming others.

I am bent out of shape that I can't night fish ML this year and that will cause me to change plans. Which I stated before, that ban will cause more people to stay away from the lake and will hurt the resorts more than a bobber fishing ban, or live bait ban, or barbed hook ban, or a lindy rigging ban. All of which are great options. IMO the night ban will hurt the resorts more than a zero walleye limit.

If the night ban does not hurt the resorts worse than a zero walleye limit, then your argument is false because the customers they will lose were fishing and staying there so they could eat fish.

Can someone point me to a fishery or species that is catch and release by rule or by volunteer action that is also in decline? As far as I know, every fishery or species in this state that is C&R is healthy or on its way to being healthier.

[GravelBar]

'Real' meat hunters don't care about limits anyway- just catching and killing.

[thatoneguy]

Predictable, reliable things:

Death

Taxes

GravelBar bashing netters and ignoring that fact that hook-and-line anglers are a bigger part of the problem.

[GravelBar]

Gravelbar believing in God's eye we are all created equal.

[CaptainMusky]

In this case, those looking for "eaters" and those that aren't. I'm not bent out of shape because I can't feed my family out of ML. There clearly are some here that are disapointed that they can't feed their families ML walleyes.

The subject of "eater" size walleyes or lack thereof is much larger than the fact of whether or not someone can bring home meals of fish from the lake. My concern for it is quite the contrary since I, like you rarely keep fish, though based on my percentage its higher than your's. I suggested the catch 2 fish and done, not because I need to keep fish, but I think it would do more good than what is currently on the table. Increasing the ratio of small to large walleyes should be the goal. It would bring things in more of a balance.

The lack of these eater size fish is and should be cause for concern. These are predominantly male fish which are very important in the spawn. The DNR has noted in their reports two alarming trends: 1) overabundance of large adult walleyes (females mainly) and 2) shockingly low numbers of smaller fish (typically males).

You can certainly argue that a 24 inch walleye has to be 17 inches before it can be 24 yada yada yada, but the fact remains that male fish do not typically get as large and reach maturity at a younger age.

By having a large number of adult fish and few small fish it could dramatically impact the success of spawning in at least two ways: 1) eggs do not get fertilized because of lack of males and/or 2) no males to protect the young as they hatch.

What I am concerned about is the approach the DNR is taking to "fix" the problem will not truly fix anything. So we will be here in the same spot 5 years from now if not worse. If they are truly interested in fixing the lake so there is a more balanced population of fish, they need to upset the applecart big time.

Completely C&R? I dont think that would help much if at all either. The only way I think it would help is that it would lead to fewer people fishing there. The harvested fish is such a small number anyway by not harvesting those fish you arent really saving much. At least from what I can tell.

I agree that night ban is really going to stink especially for musky fishermen.

IDK, its so messed up right now its not getting fixed anytime soon.

[DrJuice1980]

Predictable, reliable things:

Death

Taxes

GravelBar bashing netters and ignoring that fact that hook-and-line anglers are a bigger part of the problem.

"Well, you gotta give them time to eat that crawler/leech"

[GravelBar]

What really bothers me is the fact that the netters also have special angling regs. Their limit is 10 Walleye per day with no size restriction. Why?

[Bandersnatch]

The one thing that is patently obvious in this thread.

It's Always Someone Else's Fault.

[GravelBar]

The one thing that is patently obvious in this thread.

It's Always Someone Else's Fault.

Let's change the direction of this thread. Please share with the group Bandersnatch on how you have contributed to the current situation on Mille Lacs.

[walleye29us]

Do you guys really think the night ban will effect resorts that much? I really dont think so, but what do i know.? If the DNR wanted to lighten the fishing pressure alot, i think the night ban will do that. Bummer for the guys that love the night fishing including myself, but gotta do what the DNR want to try to help the lake.

[maxpower17]

but gotta do what the DNR want to try to help the lake.

I agree with obeying the law, but they've been warned this would happen if restrictive slot limits were imposed.

I'm not going to stand on my soapbox and tell everyone to write the DNR to have their voice heard. That's your business, you're all adults. I just get a kick out of the direction these threads take. Anglers are a really hard headed group. I find myself thoroughly embarrassed sometimes to be associated with this group.

[walleye18]

I find it troubling that the netters/spearers on this thread feel that their "entitlement" is not a cause for the downturn of Mille Lacs.....really?

Entitlements are ruining this country...and Im tired of all the baloney.

What makes one person or group have more rights than the next? Its just wrong!!!!

[Bandersnatch]

Let's change the direction of this thread. Please share with the group Bandersnatch on how you have contributed to the current situation on Mille Lacs.

I haven't fished Walleyes on the lake since the first or second year the slot was imposed (the year before WigWam resort was bought out). My father and I decided to fish Walleyes on lakes closer to home. He has since passed, and I have held to that.

No catch and release. The few that I have caught were incidental catches.

I have fished just about everything else BUT Walleyes on Mille Lac, including some amazing Carp, but mostly bobber fishing Perch and Smallmouth.

It is my opinion that Sportfishing takes 4X to 5X the number of Walleyes out of the lake that Nets do, and that it doesn't matter when you take/hooking mortality kill/ a Walleye during the year, that Walleye won't be there to spawn Next Year.

In keeping with that view I haven't used anything but a barbless hook in more than fifteen years, for any species, on any lake in Minnesota, and I promote the use of Circle Hooks on Saltwater Gamefish.

I sit on the board of directors for The Roosterfish Foundation based in Zihuatanejo Mexico.

I promote C&R of Billfish and am a card carrying member of The Billfish Foundation, and a member of the International Game Fish Association and have donated 1000s of gamefish tags for both Billfish and Roosterfish in the Zihuatanejo Mexico area.

How about you?

[laportian]

I find it troubling that the netters/spearers on this thread feel that their "entitlement" is not a cause for the downturn of Mille Lacs.....really?

Entitlements are ruining this country...and Im tired of all the baloney.

What makes one person or group have more rights than the next? Its just wrong!!!!

You again with the native bashing? C'mon get real blame the Indians for it all huh? Intelligent theory there. Back it up with something then. Wait let me guess -Treaty harvest walleye management? OK you keep ranting about that it holds so much water.

[GravelBar]

I only fished the lake for 6 hours last year. Not by choice my aorta ruptured at the end of May and I was told in the ER to have my last rites because there was no way I was going to live. Passed away twice but when I go, I'm going kicking and screaming. I will not go quiet into that good night. An installed pacemaker and I feel the best I have in years!

But I'm getting off the subject here. I have fished Mille Lacs for 40 years now. I love the lake. I no longer fish the big tournaments. I believe they should be banned until the lake recovers. This year I will fish one tournament. The military tournament. All proceeds go to help Minnesota families with members on active duty.

I do not fish Walleyes during the warm water months. From early to mid July until labor day Northerns and Muskies are my target.

I do believe the tribe should have the right to net, but limited to 20,000 pounds a year even after the lake recovers. This will allow them to celebrate their heritage while minimizing damage to the lake.

Finally I belive everybody should follow the same rules when it comes to angling.

Some or most of you might think I'm an one-who-thinks-I-am-silly. Your entitled to your thoughts.

I apologiese for singling you out from the group Bandersnatch!

[walleye18]

Hey Laportian...again, not bashing.

Why should you get to keep 10 walleyes at anytime of the year and I have to follow the State laws?

Are you better than me?

[Search Function]

The subject of "eater" size walleyes or lack thereof is much larger than the fact of whether or not someone can bring home meals of fish from the lake. My concern for it is quite the contrary since I, like you rarely keep fish, though based on my percentage its higher than your's. I suggested the catch 2 fish and done, not because I need to keep fish, but I think it would do more good than what is currently on the table. Increasing the ratio of small to large walleyes should be the goal. It would bring things in more of a balance.

The lack of these eater size fish is and should be cause for concern. These are predominantly male fish which are very important in the spawn. The DNR has noted in their reports two alarming trends: 1) overabundance of large adult walleyes (females mainly) and 2) shockingly low numbers of smaller fish (typically males).

You can certainly argue that a 24 inch walleye has to be 17 inches before it can be 24 yada yada yada, but the fact remains that male fish do not typically get as large and reach maturity at a younger age.

By having a large number of adult fish and few small fish it could dramatically impact the success of spawning in at least two ways: 1) eggs do not get fertilized because of lack of males and/or (2)no males to protect the young as they hatch.

What I am concerned about is the approach the DNR is taking to "fix" the problem will not truly fix anything. So we will be here in the same spot 5 years from now if not worse. If they are truly interested in fixing the lake so there is a more balanced population of fish, they need to upset the applecart big time.

Completely C&R? I dont think that would help much if at all either. The only way I think it would help is that it would lead to fewer people fishing there. The harvested fish is such a small number anyway by not harvesting those fish you arent really saving much. At least from what I can tell.

I agree that night ban is really going to stink especially for musky fishermen.

IDK, its so messed up right now its not getting fixed anytime soon.

Walleye's guarding their fry? Can't say I've ever heard of that. Can't find anything about it on Google.

[Gordie]

The one thing that is patently obvious in this thread.

It's Always Someone Else's Fault.

No, I see it as its all about ME! that's Whats obvious.

[Kyhl]

The subject of "eater" size walleyes or lack thereof is much larger than the fact of whether or not someone can bring home meals of fish from the lake. My concern for it is quite the contrary since I, like you rarely keep fish, though based on my percentage its higher than your's. I suggested the catch 2 fish and done, not because I need to keep fish, but I think it would do more good than what is currently on the table. Increasing the ratio of small to large walleyes should be the goal. It would bring things in more of a balance.

The lack of these eater size fish is and should be cause for concern. These are predominantly male fish which are very important in the spawn. The DNR has noted in their reports two alarming trends: 1) overabundance of large adult walleyes (females mainly) and 2) shockingly low numbers of smaller fish (typically males).

You can certainly argue that a 24 inch walleye has to be 17 inches before it can be 24 yada yada yada, but the fact remains that male fish do not typically get as large and reach maturity at a younger age.

By having a large number of adult fish and few small fish it could dramatically impact the success of spawning in at least two ways: 1) eggs do not get fertilized because of lack of males and/or 2) no males to protect the young as they hatch.

What I am concerned about is the approach the DNR is taking to "fix" the problem will not truly fix anything. So we will be here in the same spot 5 years from now if not worse. If they are truly interested in fixing the lake so there is a more balanced population of fish, they need to upset the applecart big time.

Completely C&R? I dont think that would help much if at all either. The only way I think it would help is that it would lead to fewer people fishing there. The harvested fish is such a small number anyway by not harvesting those fish you arent really saving much. At least from what I can tell.

I agree that night ban is really going to stink especially for musky fishermen.

IDK, its so messed up right now its not getting fixed anytime soon.

You make some great points. The lake probably is mostly C&R for walleyes anyway because the eater sizes are not to be found.

It seems the way to get the lake back into balance would be to remove the over abundant biomass so that the smaller walleye can return. I'm not sure how a night ban will accomplish this.

[CaptainMusky]

I don't think the night ban will either. The new pike and bass regs won't either IMO. So these new regs are really pointless as far as I can tell.

[laportian]

Hey Laportian...again, not bashing.

Why should you get to keep 10 walleyes at anytime of the year and I have to follow the State laws?

Are you better than me?

Calling a spade a spade on this one. Seems like you get on these once in a while and whine about the same thing.- Yes Mille Lacs Band members have a 10 fish hook and line limit. They set their own rules on the waters within their reservation. You don't get that? Let me put it this way- this would be like you fishing a border water with a Wisconsin angler and griping because they have different regs on it. Same thing here, you are sharing the lake with people that have their own rights and regs within their own territory. Another thing to point out here is the vast majority of Mille Lacs Band members will not fish a single day this season or any season for that matter. There are about 3900 band members and I would bet that the amount of band members out there fishing on Mille Lacs is pretty insignificant compared to the amount of state anglers and out of state anglers. Think about it. There are an estimated 100,000 fishing hours put on this lake in any given year. I'd bet my left one that native hook and liners would not even make up 1% of those hours.

Are we better than you? No- we just have different rules than you. Simple.

And you and I follow the same rules on Mille Lacs. I would have to follow the slot and two walleye limit too. I am not a Mille Lacs Band member. I am a Leech Lake Band member.

[Bandersnatch]

I only fished the lake for 6 hours last year. Not by choice my aorta ruptured at the end of May and I was told in the ER to have my last rites because there was no way I was going to live. Passed away twice but when I go, I'm going kicking and screaming. I will not go quiet into that good night. An installed pacemaker and I feel the best I have in years!

OH MAN!!! did you luck out!!!

(me too!)

Just over three years ago I went in for a Bi-Femoral Aortic By-Pass.

Suppose to be a 1 1/5 hour operation to replace the lower Aorta to get blood back to my legs.

When they opened me up they found an Aneurism that would have burst in a year or so, and all kinds of other "issues".

The surgeon called in his partner to assist at that point.

They ran a Garden Hose into me for blood, removed my spleen, did repairs over 5 1/5 hours, and 15 units of blood later (the human body only contains between 10 and 12 units) an a couple of Re-Starts, I was on the road to three weeks in ICU and another in general before I Got To Couch.

As with you, I'm living every one of them, and they aren't taking me out without sending in the SWAT Team!!

Luck to ya!!