Manziel Debate

[CaptainMusky]

If Spielman/Frasier still HAVE a draft board next year the fans should be burning their Viking jerseys, helga horns, and season tickets in a dumpster in front of Winter Park.

Seriously, if those two clowns still have a job after this season is over there should be a parade of pitchforks and torches heading down 494.

hahaha. So if those "clowns" DO have a draft board and Manziel is #1 on it what does that make you? Nostradumass?

[Big Dave2]

Yeah Saban's comment about Manziel having a place in the NFL sure hold a lot of weight considering all of his success in the NFL.

As opposed to YOUR unrivaled success in the NFL?

[Big Dave2]

Again, I think some of you need to take a look at JF's passing stats and the teams he accumulated them against. He is not necessarily a running QB, he is a very good passing QB who happens to also be able to run with the best of them.

[JeffB]

Johnny football will have a fine NFL career, until someone blows out his MCL, PCL and ACL. When is the last time a scrambling, running QB has won a championship in modern day NFL football? Steve Young?

Take away his running stats he is just another Andre Ware. History reveals Heisman quarterbacks find NFL difficult

Aaron Rodgers game is much like Steve Young. John Elway is in the top 10 for rushing yards for a QB all time. The quarterbacks are all getting more mobile.

[Big Dave2]

You are correct sir. The running QB has always been good for solid regular season play, but come play off time they get their a$$es handed to them. Lets look at Peyton Manning, Joe Flacco, Ben Rothlisberger, Tom Brady and Eli Manning. They have won most of the Superbowls since 2000. Throw in the ones that Rodgers and Brees won. They only run enough to move the pocket and you can really see the trend. None of the QBs mentioned are considered "running" qbs at all.

I wish Johnny all the luck and if we land him I really wish him luck, but 15 years from now he wont be anything compared to a guy like Luck.

Johnny Football's freshman year passing stats rival those of Payton Manning's Senior year stats. What else does he have to do to make you understand that he is a passing QB?

[CaptainMusky]

As opposed to YOUR unrivaled success in the NFL?

for all you know big Dave I'm bill belicheck.

[BuckSutherland]

How many rushing yards does he have, and how many did Peyton have Big Dave?

I understand that you have a man crush. Maybe I should have said pocket passer and you would have understood.

[zepman]

Ponder wasn't in the same draft as Luck and RG3.

My bad...I should have known that.

There was a really heavy run on QB's the year Ponder was drafted though. Point remains the same.

[Big Dave2]

How many rushing yards does he have, and how many did Peyton have Big Dave?

I understand that you have a man crush. Maybe I should have said pocket passer and you would have understood.

I imagine he had a whole lot more rushing yards than Payton Manning which would make him an even more valuable college player over-all. What does that have to do with comparing Manning's passing stats to Manzeil's?

Pocket passer? You mean like Christian Ponder?

[JBMasterAngler]

Suppose Manziel doesn't even come out for the draft, and decides to stay in school 1 more year. Will this thread continue to go on?

[CaptainMusky]

JB that is a foolish question. Its quite obvious that the college game is too small for him. I mean just think of the autographs he can be paid for when he turns pro.

[Stick in Mud]

for all you know big Dave I'm bill belicheck.

I'm calling your bluff...unless you've purposefully spelled your name wrong just to trick me.

[muskiemanAD]

The guy has the "it" factor. He may not turn out, but I sure wouldnt want fo be the GM who passes on him. If Houston keeps loosing it will be a mute point as they are not letting Johhny football leave Texas.....

[LMITOUT]

for all you know big Dave I'm bill belicheck.

[Black_Bay]

Johnny Manziel = Todd Marinovich.

[CaptainMusky]

I'm calling your bluff...unless you've purposefully spelled your name wrong just to trick me.

My hoodie got in the way of my fingers when typing. :-)

[Big Dave2]

Johnny Manziel = Todd Marinovich.

Maybe. But what if:

Johnny Manziel = Brett Favre

?

[DrJuice1980]

Well Big Dave, then he will be a 2nd round pick. That's the only thing in common those 2 would have as an NFL QB. The bromance for Manziel is 10x's thicker than the hate. I swear Big Dave and LMIT make love to their wife's thinking about him, well probably not LMIT, he's married to his keyboard. Seriously though, can this debate be anymore redundant? I think the takes people are getting to are pretty far out there. Comparing Manziel to Peyton? Wow, calm that tent pole down there Big Dave. Here's the truth, he's a fad, the only offense that he would succeed in is the read-option, we all see where that's gone. Nowhere. If an athlete like RG3 and Kaepernick (way more athletic) what Johnny going to do? Be a pocket passer? You got to be kidding me, he's not comfortable in the pocket. A ton of his completions come when he's running and the play drags on and coverage breaks down. Well guess what, that doesn't happen in the NFL, coverage gets better the longer the play drags on, LBs are much more athletic and disciplined, the schemes are better, the NFL is a career not a means to pick up chicks and get some edgamacation. He stands no chance. Guys I assume you're grown men, take the Johnny Manziel fat head off your wall.

[BuckSutherland]

Well guess what, that doesn't happen in the NFL, coverage gets better the longer the play drags on, LBs are much more athletic and disciplined, the schemes are better,

I think you should go tell that to the Vikings. We have/had the second worst set of LBs in Pro Football. Remember?? And usually our secondary falls apart after the QB finishes dinner and is then finally flushed out of the pocket by $18 million a year loser Jared Allen. I cant count how many plays the QB had 5-10 seconds against our invisible pass rush only to torch us as stopped coverage to go beat their women.

[BuckSutherland]

You are correct that Big Dave is clueless though juice. He reminds me of a dog that runs in a circle trying to catch his tail but just never gets there.

[LMITOUT]

Suppose Manziel doesn't even come out for the draft, and decides to stay in school 1 more year. Will this thread continue to go on?

Yes. If Leslie is still here and they fall for the moronic idea of taking a MLB with their first pick of the draft they'll be right back in the same position they are now...at the bottom and needing a QB which they should have taken the year before.

Rinse.

Repeat.

[DrJuice1980]

Being you like comparisons so much LMIT:

Draft QBs in the first round for the next 6 yrs until we get one that works. Who are you Matt Millen? How many wasted picks did the throw away on WRs? Where did that get them? And don't even say it got them Megatron cause then your credibility would get thrown right out the window. They sucked forever because of those wasted picks. But let go ahead and do the same thing rather than drafting a player.

Rinse.

Repeat.

We should've got one of those stud QBs last season, EJ Manual and Gino Smith would've made this season a winner.

What a fool.

[thatoneguy]

Well guess what, that doesn't happen in the NFL, coverage gets better the longer the play drags on

Possibly the dumbest statement in this whole thread, and that's saying something. There is no level of football in which coverage gets better the longer a play runs. Period.

[DrJuice1980]

Then why can't the more mobile QBs complete more passes???? Well for all the reasons stated. Hey Getaclueguy, why don't you actually watch what happens on drawn out plays in the NFL, you know, the ones Johnny is so famous for.

BTW Getaclueguy, in case you weren't aware, the called routes break off by then and no QB really knows where the WRs are going. It's a guessing game for the most part. But I would expect you thought they were scribbling those plays on their palms in the huddle. Wow what a great remedial football mind!!!!

[Big Dave2]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9234917/johnny-football-nfl-prospects

http://www.star-telegram.com/2013/09/17/5171374/what-are-johnny-footballs-draft.html

http://www.isportstimes.com/articles/9352/20131101/minnesota-vikings-draft-johnny-manziel.htm

[DrJuice1980]

Great in-depth article by Dean Jones at iSports Times. Haha, digging deep these days huh Big Dave? Find a recent article, and maybe when defending Manziel you should find ones that don't compare him to Rex Grossman and RG3. Haha. Kiss that Johnny Football fat head good night for me Big Dave. Haha

[creepworm]

Then why can't the more mobile QBs complete more passes???

Accuracy issues. Seeing johnny football leads the NCAA in accuracy, which no other mobile qb has done, he can't be compared to a strictly mobile qb.

[DrJuice1980]

There won't be 8 guys in the box defending Manziel in the NFL creep.

[LMITOUT]

Draft QBs in the first round for the next 6 yrs until we get one that works. Who are you Matt Millen?

The alternative is do nothing and wait for this mythical Mr. Perfect you think will just come along and fall right into the Vikings laps while logging 3-13 records year after year. Who are you? Leslie Frazier?

Rinse.

Repeat.

What a fool.

[Hester]

I hate to defend Lmit, but at least he is going out on a limb and picking a QB he thinks the Vikes should draft. A QB will not just fall in your lap, you need to pull the trigger on a guy that has a shot at being a franchise guy. Jonny FB definatly has that chance of being the guy. Some how the Vikes thought Ponder had that chance. The problem was, the vikes tried it and waited to long to pull the plug on him.