Upland dog choice

[Guest Kyle]

I've got a golden retriever who has been doing great as a waterfowl dog, but just doesn't have the energy and body stature(not fat, but large) to withstand a day of pheasant hunting.

If you could have any dog for pheasants, based on natural ability, drive, athletic ability/stamina, good nature indoors/with people, and the ability to turn it off(not hyperactive) when necessary, what would you get?

[mcne0101]

I have a GSP, he's relatively big 65-70 pounds but he is so long and tall that he can go for days.

He is an awesome house dog but then again my wife runs him in the morning, I run him in the evening, and we have a half acre that he roams all day. A dog that can hunt all day is going to have a lot of energy that it needs to expend or it will get "hyperactive". I love running the dog so a GSP is a good fit for me, if you don't have a lot of land and/or you don't enjoy running your dog at minimum once a day I wouldn't suggest getting a GSP.

[Ufatz]

You may be underestimating your dogs abilities. A whole lot of pheasants have been killed over G.Retrievers and other game birds too. Why do you say it not have the stamina? Why not take dog for a couple hunts and see how interested it is and how excited dog gets at bird smells, tracking, shooting....the whole experience.

There are of course several other breeds you can investigate for upland bird hunting but I think you HAVE the dog now that will take care of it.

Honestly, a Lab for ducks and a GR for pheasants is the way things work around this place and it has been that way for a bunch of decades. Just some thoughts.

[Ryan_V]

Another vote for gsp. Love mine! Don't keep my dogs in the house anymore, but had one in the the house for ten years. Very good disposition, loves kids, will go all day in the field. As stated above, give them exercise or they can be a little hyper. just the best all around dog I've ever seen.

[GSP4EVER]

<------- Another vote for GSP. I dont have land for him to run, so its to the dog park for a minimum of 1 hour. Everyday except for heavy rain or blinding snow. And you can tell when he doesnt get to go. He is a PITA. He is an amazing house dog and keeps pretty mellow most of the time. He is a cuddler. BUt since the leaves started changing colors, he has been antsy. Finally get to take him out for the first hunt of the year tomorrow.

[Guest Kyle]

Ufatz

I don't disagree that GR's are great dogs, and can be great upland dogs. I have not hunted my dog for pheasants much, and he does not get ran enough for me to expect him to be able to go all day, and yes his drive is just fine when he smells something or hears the shot. Having said that, I know that my dog get's bored, and just simply doesn't have the athletic ability, even if he was in better shape, to run all day for pheasants. He's a lean 90lb golden retriever. By lean I mean he's not carrying excess weight, but his muscles are probably not quick as strong as they could be. Anyway, I may just try to get a better blood line of GR for next time, or a I may go with a totally different breed. I really hate having to pick burrs out of his hair constantly too...Otherwise I love him, and he does fine!

[gspman]

A GSP or an English Pointer are the only 2 dogs for me. I'd throw English Setters in there too but I don't want to deal with the long fur. If I was a flusher kinda guy it'd be a field trial bred springer spaniel.

[Todd Caswell]

Ufatz

I don't disagree that GR's are great dogs, and can be great upland dogs. I have not hunted my dog for pheasants much, and he does not get ran enough for me to expect him to be able to go all day, and yes his drive is just fine when he smells something or hears the shot. Having said that, I know that my dog get's bored, and just simply doesn't have the athletic ability, even if he was in better shape, to run all day for pheasants. He's a lean 90lb golden retriever. By lean I mean he's not carrying excess weight, but his muscles are probably not quick as strong as they could be. Anyway, I may just try to get a better blood line of GR for next time, or a I may go with a totally different breed. I really hate having to pick burrs out of his hair constantly too...Otherwise I love him, and he does fine!

Kyle,

I'm a lab guy, because I mainly hunt waterfowl, and I love the retriever games FT and HT. Through out the seasons I have the opportunity to run a nd judge all of the retriever breeds, labs are my favorite, goldens would be my second choice. ALOT of goldens can be abit lazy at times and need to be pushed differently than a lab, I do believe that most goldens have a better nose than most labs and it can get them in trouble at times, hunting good trialing not so good.. After reading your post I'll be completly honest with you, it doesn't sound like the dog or the breed of dog is your problem, it sounds like your lack of time to spend training your current dog is the real problem.. I personally would love to own, train and hunt a dozen different dogs but realise 3 is more than enough to handle in a training situation and during hunting season they have to take there turns...

[Kyhl]

To answer the question for me, I'm a pointer guy, GSP, Vizsla, or English, if I had the space for an Englis to run. I just love to watch them work. Retrievers bore me, except for two that amazed me this at a competition this spring that were simply amazing machines with great drive, personalities, and noses. I had the pleasure of judging one young lab that I swear he knew where every bird was planted in the field before we left the gate.

As for drive and stamina, bloodlines makes a difference but so does training, and personality. One of my pointers has no off switch. If she's awake, she's hunting, and I think that has a lot to do with personality as much as anything else.

We go to the park and she hits the weeds running with nose down. She doesn't care about any other dog there because hunting is play time to her.

My other dog with a good pedigre is more of a clown and although she likes to hunt, she likes play and run just as much as to hunt.

So I don't think it is really breed specific, or bloodlines, or training, or personality, but really a combination of all of the above, plus a lot of dumb luck.

[nofishfisherman]

I have a Vizsla so of course I'm partial to them. They are similar to the GSP but are smaller in stature.

My Vizsla will run all day long but he also knows what to do inside. If he has too much energy one day he won't tear around the house like a crazy dog, but he'll walk around more checking things out. If he gets even a minimal amount of exercise though he pretty much just crashes on the couch or lays down and chews a bone. I live in St. Paul so have a smallish yard and the dog does fine. He runs along the fence with the neighbor dog and when he really has energy he'll sprint laps around the yard for fun. Beyond that I'll take him to the dog park, take him for walks, wrestle around the yard with him, and that seems to be enough for him. But take him out in the field for a day and you'll tire out long before he will.

Every Vizsla I've ever met is a great family dog. In fact they need to be inside with the family. They won't do well as an outdoor kennel dog, they are too social so tend to turn neruotic if left to live mainly in an outdoor kennel.

They tend to bond very strongly to the main handler but pretty much love everyone. My dog will follow me to the ends of the earth and is always by my side.

[WaveWacker]

English Springer Spaniel for me. Always has been...always will be

[DaSwede]

I had a 85-90 lb lab. When he was in his prime, he'd go all day. The difference was I spent a lot of time getting him in condition for pheasant season. As he got older, we just did shorter hunts.

I now own a British lab. He's smaller and more agile than my last lab. I expect with good conditioning, he too will be able to go all day.

[NoWiser]

Don't forget to check out Brittany Spaniels. I love mine and wouldn't trade him for anything. He'll hunt every bit as good as any GSP I've seen, and is the best family dog we've ever had. Plus, I like that not everyone and their brother has one. I'll probably never own a different breed.

I personally think everyone who hunts upland birds owes it to themselves to try a pointer. I've hunted with some good flushers, and there is no doubt they are fun, but nothing compares to hunting behind a good pointer.

[MNUser]

Brittany spaniel here. The best dog I have ever had. Great hunter and an awesome family dog. Lives in the house all day while we are at work at does great. I swear when I come it is like he has not seen me in a week. He understands a ton and is always by my side. Not sure what I will do when he is gone.

[setterguy]

If I was a pheasant hunter only a field springer would be my choice.

[Guest Kyle]

Todd,

You are right. It's me not him. Where I lack in training is my ability to figure out how to keep my dog(Bear) interested. He's good for a few retrieves/until he burns off that initial energy(which doesn't take much with dummies) and then he gets lazy and bored. How do I keep him motivated on a daily basis with dummies. I do not live in the country so most of my training takes place in parks, or at the cabin where I can throw dummies in the lake for him. I don't have the option of storing and using chucker or live birds. His prey drive is superb, but he loses it with dummies...I assume this isn't unique to my dog. It's also hard for me to want to continue to train on a daily basis when my dog isn't that excited about it either. I took him pheasant hunting today, just he and I. I was so impressed with him today. Not because he flushed that many birds, but simply because he was hunting for 5 straight hours with short breaks. He always does everything better when its just he and I, but today kind of change my perspective one what I think my dog is capable of athletically. At this point, I just don't think he has been on enough pheasants to really know what he's looking for. He gets excited about deer trails as much as a pheasant, duck, or meaningless tweety bird.

[DaSwede]

He's good for a few retrieves/until he burns off that initial energy(which doesn't take much with dummies) and then he gets lazy and bored. How do I keep him motivated on a daily basis with dummies.

One thing to do is buy some pheasant wings and scent. Tape the wings on to the dummies. Add the scent on them and drag it through some grass. Do anything to add some "real world" qualities to the training. This will help keep him more interested (at least it did/does for my dogs).

[Guest Kyle]

Todd,

I think I used to have your email address but I don't any more. You seem to know a lot about dogs and training. If possible, could we possibly exchange email addresses or even phone numbers? I would like to rack your brain a little. lol

[Todd Caswell]

Kyle,

My email is [email protected] my cell is 218-821-0402.

Goldens are funny dogs I love them to death but, there different. We have a female that we sit from time to time, I did her CC and her FF, she's lazy as hell and a pain in the azz to train, but she's my buddy when she's here, she sleeps on the bed does most every thing I ask of her and has a hell of a nose. But isn't real fond of big water swims or big marks in general, once she realises she HAS to do it, she settles in and were good. But if you let her quit she'd be more than happy to do so..

Give me a call Id'e be more than happy to chat...

Todd

[PurpleFloyd]

That is a tough question. I have one Springer laying to the right of me and one laying to the left of me as I type this. I have had Springers for 20 years and love them to death, but there are so many fantastic dogs out there that it pays to look at all options. Up to a few years ago hunting behind the flushers was a great thrill and it kept me moving but with some big time knee problems I have been thinking that my next dog might very well be either a large Munsterlander, an English Setter or something like that. The way you hunt, the terrain you hunt and the way you shoot all can make a difference. Just make sure to enjoy the dog for what it is and don't buy a particular breed and try to make it something it isn't.

[RoosterRedneck]

GSP for me. The only other dog I've ever owned though was a springer. 3 of my close friends all have labs and on an average day of hunting they do fine and last about 3/4 of the day. We also go out to South Dakota for 2 periods of 5 straight days of hunting and usually by day 3 the labs are hunting 1/4 to 1/2 the day. I also think a lot has to do with how they hunt. The labs are plowing through nose to the ground which takes a lot of energy. I watch most GSP's smelling the air and running over cover instead of under it.

[HawgMan]

+1 for the Brittany

[nige]

For me it will be a GSP. Grew up with them and my dad hunted with a GSP back home in Ireland. Great family dog especially with kids.

[Guest Kyle]

For all of the GSP lovers,

How do you deal with the hyperactivity? I have multiple friends who have them, and I have read quite a bit about them, and I get the same picture...I also hear they never stop hunting, and that they are unreal hunters, but just like someone else said previously our dogs hunt maybe 3-4 months/year. For the other 8 months, I wonder how the average working person can deal with the energy levels of this breed?

[Sorgy]

I grew up with a Britt named Bandit. He had ZERO interest in dummies and balls and such-BUT put a wing on that dummy and he was all buisness.

Best hunting dog I have ever been privleged to hunt over. Very great family dog.

We also had 2 other Britts. Timbers Goldtone Joker- ABC Central Futurity Winner and ABC national Futurity winner 1986- He was a clown around the house and went to train for a couple of months a year. Joker passed on a training trip to the Sand Hills of Nebraska in 1987/1988? He had potential to be a all time great field trial Britt. Boy he could run but he was not the hunter that Bandit was. Both were great dogs for the family and both were large for Britts.

Interesting post

Steve

[jparrucci]

Agree with others on the Brittany. Great around the house, amazing in the field. Mine hunts ducks and geese and we send him more than the labs we hunt with for retrieves. He gets to be a pain late winter when he doesn't get much exercise, but that is mostly due to me not liking the cold and not getting him out. Gsps are great dogs and I have spent a ton of time around then. Like others have noted, they are very hyper and need tons of exercise.

My Brittany won't retrieve a tennis ball or sticks either, but he out runs and out swims other dogs for real birds.

[TylerS]

Wirehairs! Do something different than the same old vanilla.

My GWP Remy has the exact "switch" you speak of. He's a love in the house, cuddles with my wife, is great with kids and visitors, but turns into an absolute bird-finding beast when hunting. Be it grouse, pheasants, ducks, or 15-pound honkers, my little 50-pound Remy finds and retrieves them all.

Plus, you gotta love hunting behind pointers. Nothing else quite like it!

[Todd Caswell]

Wirehairs! Do something different than the same old vanilla.

My GWP Remy has the exact "switch" you speak of. He's a love in the house, cuddles with my wife, is great with kids and visitors, but turns into an absolute bird-finding beast when hunting. Be it grouse, pheasants, ducks, or 15-pound honkers, my little 50-pound Remy finds and retrieves them all.

Plus, you gotta love hunting behind pointers. Nothing else quite like it!

I agree Tyler some day if I ever get over the retriever gsmes and strictly want a gun dog I will own a Wirehair, there was a guy on Nodak that used to post from time to time, he was a Retriever FT pro for many years when he got out of the game he baught a wirehair and told me it was the most naturaly talented gun dog he had ever trained, but told me if you expect them to train and handle like a lab youll be disapointed, but if your looking for an all around gun dog with great natural abilities the wirehair is a great dog. Plus you gotta love the beard...

[raymondk]

if you want a pointer the only real choice would be a britney.

[jjz]

Kyle,

For one cut down on the dummy work if your dog knows the drill, going over it till it gets bored with it is doing you and it no favors. Unless you plan to force fetch, let hunting do the training. Any hunting dog that is average will get more benefit from hunting than training. To me it just sounds like you need to hunt more, the rest will take care of itself. I would just hunt in flusher cover, willows, cattails and heavy stuff, places the birds are concentrated and will allow success without covering tons of ground, but covering it well. My old springer male was similar, got bored with training fast, but once I hunted him a lot and got birds under his belt he has made retrieves I never thought possiable some a full section in distance and 45 minutes to complete. As far as best breed for pheasants, any can be, kinda a ford/chevy thing. You really need to do homework on the parents, that is more important than anything on how the pups turn out. For burs shave him down and very closely trim the fur in and around the paws if his feet are fuzzy, sand burs and ice balls love fuzzy feet.

Good Luck