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berfish

Land ?

Question

berfish

Has anyone has any experience with this?

The land my girlfriend purchased has a "legal description" that is decribed differently in three documents. Is the "legal description " that she signed when she bought the land the final and correct description? The reason this is important is the fact she has horses that will be grazing and people will be hunting the land. The neighbor, who is the original land owners brother, bought 10 acres from the previous land owner. This gives him 20 total acres to the east of my girlfriends 50 acres. But it is not included in the signed legal decription she signed at the closing. Also the 10 acres is shown in two different places on two county maps. One map is the plat book map and the other map is on the counties website. The abstract of the land my girlfriend bought shows the 10 acres was sold to the landowners brother and decribes it to the south of his land. On the plat book it decribes the new 10 acres to the west of his land. And the legal decription she signed repeats the same tract of land twice, his original 10 acres! I posted this on several sites asking the same ? Sorry for the lengthy post. Just curious.

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Big-Al

A legal description can be described correctly in more than one way, but it sounds like you have more of an issue than just that. List the ways that it is described and it can be determined if it is the same piece of land or not, but I would have an attorney that deals with property look at it.

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upnorth

Typically the abstract is correct. Did she have a closing company do the closing? They should have some info on what she actually owns as they should make sure that everything in the abstract is correct before closing. I would contact whoever did the closing to make sure they did a deed search to verify the actual legal description.

Don't rely on the opinions here or other forums, along with talking to whoever did the closing talk to a real estate attorney or at the very least go to the county for an explanation from someone who works that stuff daily. Make sure you have them look at everything you have to determine which is the accurate description.

Good luck sorting this out.

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dogs

Have the title co. clear it up if there is title insurance on the property. When purchasing property one should never rely on legal descriptions. One should walk the property with the seller and mark what you intend on buying and he intends on selling (survey it youself) or have it surveyed. A legal description is just a written description of boundary's location depicted in field, and are subservient to actual monumentation in the field. I surveyed with emphasis on land and title for 8 years, monuments rule.

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Tom7227

A legal description can be described correctly in more than one way, but it sounds like you have more of an issue than just that. List the ways that it is described and it can be determined if it is the same piece of land or not, but I would have an attorney that deals with property look at it.

I'm a retired lawyer with 34 years experience - BigAl has the correct answer - talk to a lawyer. Hopefully there was title insurance when the deal was done.

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berfish

Thanks for the replies. There is title insurance. My girlfriend and her parents walked the property with the land- owner at the first showing but he unexpectedly passed away a week later. His wife doesn't know too much. Yep...I won't rely on the replies I get but I was just curious if this happens a lot. I don't see the neighbor and my girlfriend having any issues because she understood he had the 10 acres all along. It just wasn't stated in the legal description. When we brought the homestead papers in to the county I asked to see what they had for maps and plats of the land. They sent me to the GIS department and the tech. drew up the legal description using an ArcView type program and autocad.(only 10 acres when he drew it up, so we knew we weren't misinterpreting anything) Then I showed him the county plat book (20 acres)he shrugged his shoulders and said to talk to the neighbor. I think we will just ask the neighbor what he owns and go from that. In hindsight we should have requested a survey or somehow gotten a survey done before the sale. Kinda hard to put legal "no trespassing" signs up. hehe

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sparcebag

Read the plat book, It will state in it that it is not accurate for any legal descritpions.Get the lawyer,It most likly will be surveyed at whos cost will be determinded by the Ins.

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WaveWacker

Yep, plat books can be wrong. If you want to know for sure the boundaries, only thing is to have it staked by a surveyor.

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irvingdog

Kinda hard to put legal "no trespassing" signs up. hehe

Beerfish, buddy, I gotta tell you; be careful with the "no trespassing" signs.

"Citiots" as some of the less kind rural folks like to call us, have deep attachment to land access that has been customary to them. Talk over a cup of coffee. Work out a schedule. If one of your new neighbors owns 10 acres, but is used to having access to all 60, I promise you he tells his hunting buddies he has 60 huntable acres. In Illinois, we bought 240 acres of land to be used as a camp for the mentally handicapped. We diligently posted no trespassing/keep out signs.

Then had 5 outbuildings burned to the ground.

Will it happen to you? Likely not. But it could be the difference between a gate closed or left open to your pastured horses.

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Jackpine Rob

The fact that title insurance is involved is good. Very good.

The title policy insures the legal description on the deed that she received. If there's a problem, the title policy is there to cover it.

However, it seems like you have a couple of other issues here, that are probably easily answered.

You are talking about simple squares - 10 acres, 40 acres, etc. Its not brain surgery to determine where the NE1/4 of the NE 1/4 of the SE 1/4 is located. The original government surveys have been out there for a whale of a long time, but of course finding the exact corners and lines is a job for a licensed surveyor.

Talk to the title company. They can tell you what they insured, and will probably be happy to provide you a sketch of what was purchased. If you aren't satisfied with the answer, there are still a few competent real estate lawyers out there who can advise you.

Relying on a plat book to figure things out isn't a good plan, and reading the feeble rantings of guys like me on the internet won't get the job done either.

Work with the pros.

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berfish

Irvingdog, yep we weren't going to post to keep him out. There is a sqare mile of state land next to both of us. Mainly to keep people from crossing onto private land from the public land. My girlfriend and me won't have a problem even if the guy wants to hunt some of her land. Definately going to talk to the neighbor before doing anything. Yes we are very aware of stiring the pot with the locals. I have talked to some of them. It is amazing how rumors have already started to fly about my girlfriend. Nothing serious though. Thanks again for the relpies guys.

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sparcebag

Part of todays access problems started back when most all rural owners shared access with eachother and most anyone who asked permission.Then came the people who wanted a little piece of country for their own,they got small parcels and most of these people said this is mine! I want no one on it! Posted it and ity started happening again & again!

The rural folk decided well if they want it that way (no sharing)We'll not share either.

Sad story but true! now days getting permission is like pulling teeth,because of attitudes of its mine and mine only!

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