Wolves.......?

[B@ssmaster]

Yep, I spotted a cougar too. It was on the shoulder of 371 just south of the hwy crossing of Pine River. Was at night, 2nd or 3rd Sunday in November, about an hour after dark. Had walked out of the woods following a day of deer hunting and was headed home. About 5 or 6 other cars/trucks slowed way down to take a look too.....

Was probably 6-7 years ago now........

[eyefishii]

Just to chime in on how much the wolf pop has recovered, the DNR picked up a road killed Grey here in Ill. near the Chain O Lakes state park last fall. Coyotes we have them running around all over now. But down here I think you can attribute this to the golf course geese population.

[NC2]

Cougar??? Okay, how big would a cougar be compared to a good size wolf? Not trying to pit a death match of the 2, just curious.

[Ronsay]

My wife saw a Cougar last year on the way to work a little after 5AM, it was crossing Highway 87 next to Badoura Nursery. There have been many Cougar spotting's all through the burn area, and even into the Brainerd area.

We live South of Akeley in Badoura Township, and had two of our Dog's killed by Timber Wolf about 10 years ago. one of the Dog's was a Poodle who thought he could whip the world, and the other Dog's name was Benji who looked like the one in the movie , he was older and partially blind.

My Wife was going to work and turned the corner of our driveway in the car one morning and saw Benji laying next to the telephone pole close to our house, she jumped out and he was still pumping blood out of his wound and was dead, she had to of jumped the Wolf when she left the house.

When the C.O. came, he put the events together. We could see where the Wolf caught our Poodle toward the end of our driveway which is quite long, Benji probably went to help him and could not make it back to safety before the Wolf caught and killed him. We never found the Poodle.

A federal trapper came in about 2 week's later, but the Wolf were not in the immediate area at that time.

Some years before this when my youngest Daughter was still in High school, she would ride her bike on a trail across from our driveway and take Benji with her. One day she came running home screaming with Benji at her side, she said she was coming up on a steep hill about 3/4 mile from the house and Benji was ahead of her and went over the hill, she said that Benji came running back squealing. She jumped off her bike and was looking at a large light colored wolf with it's hair standing up and snarling with it's teeth showing as it was coming up the hill, she screamed and never looked back as she ran all the way to the house still screaming.

I went back there right away and found a set of large tracks, the Wolf was probably startled when they saw each other, and she started screaming.

We now own two Great Pyrenees, one female and one male, they are used to protect livestock from Wolf and Bear.

A couple years ago my wife was outside and yelling for me, right behind our house was a large Black Bear in one of our 30+ year old Norway Pine stands about 200' from the house. Our female Pyrenees was holding the Bear at bay, the Bear was swatting the ground and trees with her claws and would attack the Pyrenees once in awhile, Maggie would sidestep the Bear and immediately start pushing it back with her side to side motions. I was scouting our tree tops for Cub's and could not see any, I was concerned for our dog's so I used my 9mm pistol to scare the Bear off, it took two shot's in the ground to get her going and several more to get her about a block away in the Norway's where I could still see her standing and looking back. As hard as I searched the tree tops I could not see anything until two cubs started coming down crying, the Bear was running back at this time and I called our Pyrenees and headed to the house. The Bears never came back as far as I know.

I noticed in the beginning of this post that some one had mentioned two dog's killed in the area and I made this post to tell our experience as it may have been us that they were referring to.

Ron

[NC2]

Wow! Heck of a story. Can't say I have ever seen a Great Pyrenees. What do they look like? Must be pretty good dogs for that kind of work!

[Kasota]

We have had a cabin on the 11th Crow Wing since 1994. I find your stories very interesting. Please keep posting these amazing stories.

[Ronsay]

They are a large white dog, the males can go 125# or more. I believe they have some wolf in there blood lines and are used primarily as protectors of livestock.

They were originally raised in the Pyrenees mountains and were used to protect the livestock from the Bears and Wolf. They have three layers of hair to keep them warm in sub zero temperatures, and keep them cool in the Summer.

These animals are very docile around humans, and children can pull there tails and ears with very good tolerance, the dogs will just leave when they have had enough.

They are not house dogs, and are difficult to train.

When Maggie was young, she loved to dig holes in our yard, one day she was digging and I sneaked up behind her and put my shoe to her backside. I never saw anything like it, she went straight up in the air and swung around with her teeth bared in a split second, when she saw it was me, she immediately calmed down and knew she was bad.

Ron

[Kasota]

I've heard these dogs are hard to train, and can even try to run a household if they have a timid owner. I've also read that they can be a one family dog, and can get very protective of that family. Sounds like the perfect breed for where you live.

[MOBY RICHARD*]

Over in the Duluth area fishing forum, they are reporting Wolf sightings in the City Limits under the Duluth City Bowhunt thread...

[hawghunter001]

I was talking to an old oldtimer that has a skin of a wolf dated back to when there was a bounty on them, they clipped the ears and cut the toes to show for there bounty. I had made the comment that people just didnt understand the wolf back then, he cut me off and said looky here young man we understood alright there was so many they were a danger to everything people included and now these jackasses think they have to bring them back, If you live long enough you will see that we understood alright, and you will do what we did get rid of the SOBs, ya they say they run in packs and only tke what they need ya what do you see one maybe two running around thats no pack,its out to catch and eat anything it can get its mouth on, they take only what they need, ya thats why ive seen with my own eyes a dozen sheep laying dead with only part of the hind end eaten out,or your family pet dog with its (Contact Us Please) eaten off ya youll see who understands alright when your out cutten fire wood and one comes for you youll be (Contact Us Please) glad you understood and had the double barrel with you thats all I can say. Thats about all he had to say about the wolf you could tell he had no like for them because of what he had experienced with them and I just wonder what will really come to be with them? The one thing he said about the pack I know all ive seen is 1 or 2 like he said not what they show on discovery channel.

[EBass]

Cool thread - keep the stories coming.

I haven't seen a wolf in the wild, but I have seen a cougar. I was at my ex-GF's cabin at the time on Woman Lake. We went into Longville to rent some movies with her brother. I don't know what road we took but going out to Longville I saw a tan, low to the ground, yet large animal with a long tail scamper across the road. I slow down and turn my truck in the direction it was going and put on my brights then stop. All of a sudden it jumped on my hood and growled and ripped off the windshield wiper - OK I'm kidding. I just saw it's tail take off into the brush.

And on the way back we saw it again in the same place now going across the road where it came from. It looked like a good sized cat to me.

I saw a coyote this year to on a lake shore in the SW metro. I was like what's a dog doing out here by it's self. I'm putzing closer in my boat. Then the light bulb came on. Hmm, a lone dog, it's gray, skinny, big but not huge. I go in for a closer look and it walks off into the trees/brush. In the summer I heard the pack yelping or howling towards dusk a couple of times.

[hawghunter001]

This is not about wolves but worse, COUGAR I was told the DNR released 11 between Walker and Akeley to help control the deer pop has any body heard anything like that?

[MinnesotaBoatman]

One had moved to Floodwood!

http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/articles/index.cfm?id=51986&section=homepage

http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/gfx/photos/stories/pxlion1011web.jpg

Picture proves mountain lions prowl Northland

Sam Cook Duluth News Tribune

Published Thursday, October 11, 2007

If you’re wondering whether mountain lions exist in northern Minnesota, Jim Schubitzke of Floodwood has a photo you might want to see.

It’s on a single frame from a digital trail camera. The camera recorded the image on Aug. 20 about 20 miles north of Floodwood.

And it’s definitely a mountain lion, or cougar.

“In the 25 years I’ve been here, it’s the first one in my work area when someone got a picture,” said Rich Staffon, Department of Natural Resources area wildlife manager at Cloquet. “It’s pretty likely that this is a wild mountain lion, not one that someone turned loose.”

Schubitzke said he had five trail cameras in the woods during the summer to monitor deer movements.

“I was lucky. This was the only one that had a flash on it,” he said.

The other cameras would have recorded the cat in black and white, but this shot is in color. The big cat, probably a male, Staffon said, was passing by a mineral block that Schubitzke had placed to attract deer. Schubitzke pulled all of his cameras out of the woods Oct. 1.

[MOBY RICHARD*]

That looks like a Bigboy! Yikes!!!

[Heartman]

Hawghunter -

I would say it is HIGHLY unlikely the DNR released 11 cougars to control the deer population.

Think about it for a minute...highly unlikely, more likely impossible, unfounded, and untrue.

[Nate McVey]

That was me, and sure as s**t, 2 wolves right under my stand. I have never seen wolves in the "wild" (when I lived in MT, I saw them in Yellowstone). Another guy in my zone had one of them run by him a few days later. They are there, and the pack is growing in this area.

[hawghunter001]

Well actually I did think about it and when it comes to our DNR anything is possible thats why I asked, Look at the fun we have with our little japanese beetles they brought them in to control a moth but nothing eats them. But on the cougar 3 different people had said they heard about it around akeley here so i thought I would ask. And something like that the dnr isnt going to tell you first,

[MOBY RICHARD*]

Happy belated B-day Shiner, I have heard many, and seen few.

One in Yellowstone decades ago, one in Northern Pine Co.,

Two and one, a ways East of North Branch, and tracked a few, in deep Winter, East of there. Seen Probable tracks a few places also...

They are awesome creatures, but scary to track, in the dead of Winter, and the middle of Nowhere, without a firearm, when the light starts failing...I got spooked, and turned tail...

In some of the old pictures with Trappers and Hunters with Wolves hanging like deer, some of those critters look like 150-200 Pounders!

Canis/Dog Lupis/Wolf; 24 subspecies, of which 7 are thought to be extinct.

Canis Lupis-lycaon; Eastern Timber Wolf, used to cover most of Eastern US as far West as Minnesota, as far South as Florida.

Largest recorded Gray/Grey Wolf in North America; Alaska, 175# 1939.

Typical Mature weight, 100-125#, in Northern American Forests.

Typical Mature weight, 50-60#, in Southern areas.

Maximum speed 40MPH, short periods.

Cruising speed 6MPH, for miles.

16'+ Max., in a single bound.

One Wolf typically takes 18-20 deer per year.

1965, Minnesota Bounty Ended, $35.

1974, Open season ended, Federal Law put Listed as Endangered.

2007, Delisted as endangered, but still listed as Protected, with no open season.

Approximate Current Wolf Populations:

Minnesota, 3500

Wisconsin, 500

Michigan, 500

Alaska, 6-8000 Unprotected

Canada, 60,000 Unprotected

Elsewhere;

Russia, 45,000, 15,000 killed each year, but

population remains stable.

Kazakhstan, 90,000, in only 1 million square

miles,(about 12 times the size of Minnesota, but

more than 25 times the Wolves, so kinda like MN

had double the current population), 15,000 killed

each year, but population is increasing!

[Nate McVey]

Thanks Moby......I can tell you I was a little spooked walking out of the woods that night myself........have not seen them since and hopefully don't see them again.......kind of ruins a day of hunting

[MOBY RICHARD*]

Wow, I just got done searching Wolf attacks in N America and found some interesting stuff!

Though it is often touted that there are no Verifiable Wolf attacks in N.A....

A verifiable Fatality occurred in Nov 2005, Saskatchewan.

A Surveyor left his camp and was found partially consumed in an area where 4 Wolves had been consuming discarded

Human waste.

There are at least 26 other confirmed attacks in N.A. in modern times.

Most attacks occur in remote or rural areas and are not therefore verified and therefore not accepted as valid.

There are many well documented attacks in the 1800s and early 1900s.

There is a well documented attack in the 1700s, where a pack of Wolves went repeatedly into an American Indian Village suffering from Smallpox, and ate the dead and dying.

A Farmer and his son were partially comsumed by Wolves in the 1800s.

A missing man and the two who went to look for him were found, killed by Wolves in Ontario, 1922.

In other countries:

There are thousands of attacks in Asia/India every year and Hundreds killed, many eaten, mostly Children.

Many Attacks in Russia annually.

Have been many attacks and Deaths in Europe for Centuries, though only a few nowdays.

I always thought it was a bit fishy that no attacks were recorded...

I think I will be even more spooked, next Wolf sign I see...

[Scott M]

I think the public is going to get some more information about wolves as the DNR has a hired a new person to oversee the recent release of wolf management from federal to state control. I understand they are trying to build a database of wolf encounters and evidence to certifiable see where they have wolf packs.

Hopefully with more information given to the public the wolf will be less social pariah and subject of fear and loathing and more of an animal to be valued for its ecological role and its beauty in the wild.

From "Thinking Like a Mountain" in 'A Sand County Almanac' by Aldo Leopold

Quote:

---

A deep chesty bawl echoes from rimrock to rimrock, rolls down the mountain, and fades into the far blackness of the night. It is an outburst of wild defiant sorrow, and of contempt for all the adversities of the world. Every living thing (and perhaps many a dead one as well) pays heed to that call. To the deer it is a reminder of the way of all flesh, to the pine a forecast of midnight scuffles and of blood upon the snow, to the coyote a promise of gleanings to come, to the cowman a threat of red ink at the bank, to the hunter a challenge of fang against bullet. Yet behind these obvious and immediate hopes and fears there lies a deeper meaning, known only to the mountain itself. Only the mountain has lived long enough to listen objectively to the howl of a wolf.

Those unable to decipher the hidden meaning know nevertheless that it is there, for it is felt in all wolf country, and distinguishes that country from all other land. It tingles in the spine of all who hear wolves by night, or who scan their tracks by day. Even without sight or sound of wolf, it is implicit in a hundred small events: the midnight whinny of a pack horse, the rattle of rolling rocks, the bound of a fleeing deer, the way shadows lie under the spruces. Only the ineducable tyro can fail to sense the presence or absence of wolves, or the fact that mountains have a secret opinion about them.

My own conviction on this score dates from the day I saw a wolf die. We were eating lunch on a high rimrock, at the foot of which a turbulent river elbowed its way. We saw what we thought was a doe fording the torrent, her breast awash in white water. When she climbed the bank toward us and shook out her tail, we realized our error: it was a wolf. A half-dozen others, evidently grown pups, sprang from the willows and all joined in a welcoming melee of wagging tails and playful maulings. What was literally a pile of wolves writhed and tumbled in the center of an open flat at the foot of our rimrock.

In those days we had never heard of passing up a chance to kill a wolf. In a second we were pumping lead into the pack, but with more excitement than accuracy: how to aim a steep downhill shot is always confusing. When our rifles were empty, the old wolf was down, and a pup was dragging a leg into impassable slide-rocks.

We reached the old wolf in time to watch a fierce green fire dying in her eyes. I realized then, and have known ever since, that there was something new to me in those eyes - something known only to her and to the mountain. I was young then, and full of trigger-itch; I thought that because fewer wolves meant more deer, that no wolves would mean hunters' paradise. But after seeing the green fire die, I sensed that neither the wolf nor the mountain agreed with such a view.

Since then I have lived to see state after state extirpate its wolves. I have watched the face of many a newly wolfless mountain, and seen the south-facing slopes wrinkle with a maze of new deer trails. I have seen every edible bush and seedling browsed, first to anaemic desuetude, and then to death. I have seen every edible tree defoliated to the height of a saddlehorn. Such a mountain looks as if someone had given God a new pruning shears, and forbidden Him all other exercise. In the end the starved bones of the hoped-for deer herd, dead of its own too-much, bleach with the bones of the dead sage, or molder under the high-lined junipers.

I now suspect that just as a deer herd lives in mortal fear of its wolves, so does a mountain live in mortal fear of its deer. And perhaps with better cause, for while a buck pulled down by wolves can be replaced in two or three years, a range pulled down by too many deer may fail of replacement in as many decades. So also with cows. The cowman who cleans his range of wolves does not realize that he is taking over the wolf's job of trimming the herd to fit the range. He has not learned to think like a mountain. Hence we have dustbowls, and rivers washing the future into the sea.

We all strive for safety, prosperity, comfort, long life, and dullness. The deer strives with his supple legs, the cowman with trap and poison, the statesman with pen, the most of us with machines, votes, and dollars, but it all comes to the same thing: peace in our time. A measure of success in this is all well enough, and perhaps is a requisite to objective thinking, but too much safety seems to yield only danger in the long run. Perhaps this is behind Thoreau's dictum: In wildness is the salvation of the world. Perhaps this is the hidden meaning in the howl of the wolf, long known among mountains, but seldom perceived among men.

---

[Treble Hook]

Chise, great post! I really enjoyed reading that.

Hopefully we as a state can come to the same realization that Leopold did after he shot those wolves.

[fishermusk]

I believe that Minnesota should have a lottery system for hunting and trapping wolves. Right now the feds take care of dozens of depredation cases in Minnesota alone, there is a story in this weeks Outdoor News about the federal goverment and their need to control wildlife throughout the USA.

I copied this from another site.

Student 1st North American killed by wolves?

Published: Tuesday, October 30, 2007

PRINCE ALBERT, Sask. -- A coroner's inquest began yesterday to determine whether the death of an Ontario student in northern Saskatchewan two years ago is the first documented case of a fatal wolf attack in North America.

"We're hoping the truth comes out," Kim Carnegie of Oshawa said during the first day of the week-long inquest into his son's death.

"We're hoping the Saskatchewan government admits our son was killed by wolves. ... It's hard to have closure when people are trying to lie about how your son died," he said, choking back tears.

Font:****Engineering student Kenton Carnegie, 22, was last seen alive as he headed out for an afternoon walk from a work camp at the Points North Landing supply depot on Nov. 8, 2005.

Two hours later, worried co-workers found him mauled to death, surrounded by wolf tracks.

There has never been a documented case of a fatal wolf attack in North America.

An expert for the coroner's office is to testify later this week that Carnegie was killed by a black bear. Another expert called by the family will testify he was killed by wolves.

Points North Landing is located 850 kilometres north of Saskatoon.

It will be up to the six-member jury sitting in the inquest at a Prince Albert hotel to come to a conclusion and make recommendations to prevent similar deaths.

Prince Albert is 140 kilometres northeast of Saskatoon.

Wolves were known to frequent an unfenced dump, located on Crown land near the Points North compound, before Carnegie's death.

Todd Svarckopf, a pilot for Sander Geophysics Ltd., testified he and a co-worker had to fight off two aggressive wolves with sticks on Nov. 4, four days before Carnegie's death. He said he thought the wolves were trying to kill them.

"They snapped their teeth constantly at us," said Svarckopf.

Svarckopf said when he learned Carnegie, a University of Waterloo student on a work term with Sander Geophysics, had not returned from a walk on Nov. 8, he and others went looking for him.

They followed his footprints in the snow, leading into the woods, and found his body.

"The wolves were all around us howling," said Mark Eikel, an assistant manager at Points North who helped with the search. "It was quite an eerie feeling."

Too scared to stay with the body, Eikel waited in a pickup truck with another worker on a nearby road until an RCMP officer and coroner arrived.

RCMP Const. Al Noey testified he could see glowing eyes in the dark when he finally reached Carnegie's body, which had been dragged several metres from the spot where the other workers found him.

He said he could hear animals moving in the bush, as if they were "trying to get their kill back."

"The body was, like, pretty chewed up," Noey said.

"The top midsection to the thigh -- it was all eaten up."

Dr. Nico Brits, the pathologist who performed the autopsy, testified Carnegie had lost about 25 to 30 per cent of his body mass in the attack.

Good Luck,

Dave

[MOBY RICHARD*]

fishermuskie, if you check out my post on the previous page, I think that is the same guy I was referring to.

Fatal attacks have been required to have an eyewitness to the attack to be documented...unfortunately the best witnesses are killed in the attack...

There have been documented attacks where the victim survived...but could have died.

I know the number of attacks is small, but so is the number of close encounters.

I am not trying to demonize Wolves, I just find it misleading to expect that a wild Wolf has never attacked and killed a Human.

Post Script to my previous post about sightings and hearings...I forgot about the bunch in Aitkin County that were howling all around me, at night, in late winter, while on a frozen lake, ice fishing, walked out, no shelter...got the hair up on the back of my neck...

[hawghunter001]

After talking to a few hunters this season I had two connections both parties that were wondering where the heck the deer were also talked of all the wolves they were hearing ahhh Im no scientist but doesnt 2&2 make 4,One area was in the Beltrami Island Forest the party owned the land for years and did very well this year 3 deer of 7 guys another note from them and myself was the lack of fawns for the mild winter there numbers were way down I thought saw the does but no fawns. The other area w2as out south of walker where the 2 dogs were killed by wolves again big lack of deer than norm. Now I am not saying the wolves killed all the deer but they do chase and the deer do get out of the area, the doe with no fawn is one of 2 things in my mind wolves 1. get them at birth 2. chase the doe while prego and cause her to abort, or there just arent enough bucks to do the breeding anymore.

[chris3]

I live just north of the woodtick by the casino and all I seen were pairs of fawns and small bucks. 12 total, must be those those dang trumpter swans. Because up to this year I always shot a nice buck. Then again, I only got to put in half the time I usually do scouting due to work. that work thing is overrated if you ask me)

hris

[jtm]

we hunt by northhome and on opening morning all I saw was 9 wolves,and no deer all day. I hope they will open a season on them soon

[hawghunter001]

Did you gat a deer