Guests - If You want access to member only forums on FM. You will gain access only when you Sign-in or Sign-Up on Fishing Minnesota.

It's easy - LOOK UPPER right menu.

  • Announcements

    • Rick

      Members Only Fluid Forum View   08/08/2017

      Fluid forum view allows members only to get right to the meat of this community; the topics. You can toggle between your preferred forum view just below to the left on the main forum entrance. You will see three icons. Try them out and see what you prefer.   Fluid view allows you, if you are a signed up member, to see the newest topic posts in either all forums (select none or all) or in just your favorite forums (select the ones you want to see when you come to Fishing Minnesota). It keeps and in real time with respect to Topic posts and lets YOU SELECT YOUR FAVORITE FORUMS. It can make things fun and easy. This is especially true for less experienced visitors raised on social media. If you, as a members want more specific topics, you can even select a single forum to view. Let us take a look at fluid view in action. We will then break it down and explain how it works in more detail.   The video shows the topic list and the forum filter box. As you can see, it is easy to change the topic list by changing the selected forums. This view replaces the traditional list of categories and forums.   Of course, members only can change the view to better suit your way of browsing.   You will notice a “grid” option. We have moved the grid forum theme setting into the main forum settings. This makes it an option for members only to choose. This screenshot also shows the removal of the forum breadcrumb in fluid view mode. Fluid view remembers your last forum selection so you don’t lose your place when you go back to the listing. The benefit of this feature is easy to see. It removes a potential barrier of entry for members only. It puts the spotlight on topics themselves, and not the hierarchical forum structure. You as a member will enjoy viewing many forums at once and switching between them without leaving the page. We hope that fluid view, the new functionality is an asset that you enjoy .
Sign in to follow this  
Mr Special

Outboard Troubles

Recommended Posts

Mr Special

I have an older "cough cough" 1993 Force50hp. Please try to stop laughing so hard grin.gif

It idles prefect, doesn't have trouble starting. Seems to cut off when shifting into gear slowly. But once it's in gear it'll run like a champ. It's not to bad shifting into foward, but I have to kinda slam it into gear. Which I figure can't be good. Shifting into reverse is the worst. Most of the time I can't get into reverse at all. I've tried messing around with the idle jets in stuff, but I'm not very good with carbs. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Or if you know of a good reliable shop, that won't charge in arm and leg be great.

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
sparcebag

Mr. S I lately heard of force 2 ? 3 ? times. Who makes it?? I have a troubble shooter OB booklet,I'll try to look it up. the shifting problem.I have an old Crystler OB I think they made a motor or a style called Force.Is that right??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mr Special

I believe the older Forces were made by Chrysler. Then they got bought out by Merc. Mine is actually made by Merc. It's supposed to be better the the Chrysler built ones. It's actually been a very good motor, up till last fall. The only other problem i had with it was a cracked lower unit. But that was due to user error, more then anything.LOL

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ralph Wiggum

I think you should just buy a River Pro--I'll be your anchor man for "Big Bertha" even grin.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mr Special

Or we can trade motors???? I'm pretty sure it's the same as mine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
eurolarva

Carbs and fuel pumps on force usually need to be rebuilt every three years or so. Carb kit is 18-7037 ($15) and the fuel pump kit is 18-7806 ($9) both availible from NAPA. Real simple to do. The fuel pump just change out the diaphram. Rebuild of the carb is pretty easy and the kit comes with instructions. Would not hurt to do a compression test. If a motor runs good on muffs but not in water that could indicate a blown head gasket or a bad cylinder. My chrysler had exactly what is happening to yours and the carb and fuel pump rebuild was the cure.

Also on the very top of the carb above the choke there is a mixture adjustment screw. This should be about 1 to 1.5 turns counterclockwise from lightly seated. If you turn this about 1/8 to 1/4 turn counterclockwise is might improve your lower idle so that you can shift without it killing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mr Special

Eurolarva,

1st off wanted to say thanks for your info.

Also could i get your direct email, i'll probably have more questions for ya. Sorry but just not very good with outboards.

again thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pikeslayer

Im not sure about your moter, but if it was mine Id check the shifting adjustment!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shamrock7

Chrysler was bought by Bayliner, Bayliner was later bought by Brunswick Marine (Mercury) I was a dealer since 1981 to 2004 and worked on many. Your problem could be alot of things. You have to have 3 main things to make an engine run. Spark, Compression and fuel and you should check them in that order. (Always start with the easiest) Check for good spark if ok, remove spark plugs and check the compression. Should be around 100 but the main thing is that they are within 10% of each other. If thats ok, take your wifes turkey baster (Don't tell her what you are going to do) and take a sample of the fuel in your tank. Tip the tank a little so you can get a sample from the lowest part ot the tank. Put your sample into a glass container and let sit for a minute. If should have a colored tint to it matching the color of oil that you use. If it has a layer of different colored stuff, you got some bad gas. Drain the tank and flush, drain the float bowls and flush out all fuel lines until you get nothing but good clean fuel/oil mix. This engine doesn't have any electronic hooked into the shift mechanisms so you don't have to worry about shift interupt switches causing your problems. This troubleshooting guide will serve everyone well and most problems will show up in one of the 3 sequences. You still may need to take it to someone that has the tools to do the actual repair but at least you know where the problem is and will help to keep you from being take advantage of by uncrupulous mechanics. Good Luck

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
eurolarva

I am pretty sure that west bend was bought by chrysler then sold to US Marine that became Force and then Mercury took on Force. My email is ralgoetz@comcast.net however you will find better help with your motor from iboats or the marine doctor. Either place will be able to answer your questions. I would start with the fuel pump first then back the mixture adjust screw an 1/8 - 1/4 turn counter clock wise. I would also get a syloc or factory manual for the force. The biggest problem with force is that maintanace is critical. These motor are prone to overheating and when that happens the motor usually gets trashed. When you look at the tips of those plugs they should be slightly wet. Also what plugs do you have in there. Are they gappless or standard plugs?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
sparcebag

Mr S I checked and I think a above answer may be right.CHECK SHIFT ADJUSTMENT! Best way to explain is ,ask EuroLarva for repair manual,He sent me mine the adjustments are explained in it.The Crystler manual is where it is.Hope this and Euro can help you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
eurolarva

He has a newer Force not a chrysler. The shift adjustment is different on his motor. It is not a shifting problem anyways. The only way it would be a shifting problem is if the lower unit was locked up. He has either bad fuel flow or a cylinder not firing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pikeslayer

When I read the post it states,it idles and runs good but dies when shifting.I beleave there is adjustments to keep you from shifting into gear at to high of RPM, If the problem is in the shifting that would explain why it dies. Also that would make it hard to shift! If this moter runs and idles good why mess with the carb!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
eurolarva

This is a common issue with force and chrysler motors. A motor in neutral has very little load. When a motor is running on one cylinder or lean it is hard to tell unless the motor is under load. Note also on the original post it says once it is in gear it runs like a champ. There are three conditions in a lower unit. It is either in neutral, in gear or transitioning between gears. If the shift shaft is misadjusted the gears will grind but the motor will not kill. The carb on that motor has three tiny holes for the idle circuit. If one of those holes is plugged this will reduce the fuel flow by 33 percent which will allow an unloaded motor to idle but not a loaded one. A good way to test if it is fuel related is to choke the motor when you shift. If the choking improves the condition of the motor instead of killing the motor the carb is your problem. The fuel pump diaphrams were designed with non ethonal type fuels and become hard after a few years of use. For 9 bucks and the simplictity of changing them it is best to do this every three years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
eurolarva

Just for closure on this thread. The motor has good compression on both cylinders 125 on each. With the cowling off water was getting into the motor via the lower exhaust gaskets. This leak was also allowing exhaust to build inside the cowling and eating all the oxygen so the motor would die. With the cowl off the motor ran fine. Good news is lower and upper gaskets is a total of 30 dollars. Bad news is the powerhead has to come off to replace these gaskets on both sides of the the spacer plate.

Also as a winterizing note. Because the motor was running poorly in the fall it was never proprerly winterized. The lower unit oil was not drained and replaced. Unfortunatly the lower unit had a leak and was full of water over the winter. When the water froze it expanded and pushed the bearing carrier away from the lower unit cracking the carrier and ripping the lower mounting screw out of the lower unit cracking it and making the lower unit trash. Always make sure lower unit oil is changed in the fall. This is very common and can trash a $3000 dollar lower unit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Bobb-o

Sparcebag, was wondering where you got the OB troubleshooting book? been looking for soemthing like that

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
eurolarva

Do a search for Clymer on the net. Syloc manuals are not very good for Force. The best would be to get a factory manual but I dont know where to get one of them. Removing that power head will be time consuming but is a fairly easy project. Make sure you use non hardening permatex. NAPA I believe calls it Aviation Permatex.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  



  • Posts

    • gimruis
      I would avoid them if I were you.  All season.  There's often at least some current flowing through there and with these warmer winters, its just a bad idea.
    • gimruis
      If your getting some pretty close shooting (and gauging by your photos you are in those setups), you might want to use an IC (improved cylinder) choke instead.  Spread that pattern out a little more and switch to some smaller shot size with more velocity, especially if you're mostly just shooting as small ducks like woodies. I almost exclusively use an IC until the calendar turns November, for ducks, pheasants, and grouse.  Later on when you get more shooting at bigger, smarter birds that are on the edge of range you could go back to a modified.
    • Sunset Lodge
      Hello from the NW Angle!   Water temps are hovering around 48 degrees and fall fishing is phenomenal! Walleyes are biting anywhere from 14 to 30ft with jigging being the most effective method. Crappies are continuing to bite around sunken trees and deep holes with a good amount of perch mixed in. Anglers have had success trolling for large pike and muskies with jigging also bringing some to the boat.    We are getting fish houses ready for the 2017-18 ice fishing season and are very excited for hard water!   We recommending checking availability for winter ASAP!   Sunset Lodge
    • fishingdad
      Thank you for the responses everyone. You are correct Del I do not have the Fiber option.  We do use the Hot spot from AT&T at times but to be honest the Data does not last all that long, Even though we are right by Moccasin point & the tower is at the end of Frazer our signal is not the best at times.  We could also do DSL but according to one neighbor we may be faster sending up carrier pigeons & waiting for a response.
    • gunner55
      It's been a 1/32 oz. unpainted jig head & a small split shot along with a crappie minnow for me most of the time. Still barely see the rod tip load or wiggle a little on the bite. Even tougher with the wind lately & 20' or more down.
    • h8go4s
      Any channel on any lake is dangerous. 
    • PSU
      We are done as of Saturday as well. Was fishing in 35 feet in Smarts Friday and had a monster, monster fish on. Thought I was snagged for a few minutes, but then felt the wiggling. Fought if for probably five - ten minutes (drag flying out) and then up came an eight inch walleye. Never saw the monster, but guessing it was massive fish, perhaps a muskie? Anyone else ever have this happen?
    • Chris-Stanton
      added many new features and options
    • MNoutdoors99
      Hey I am planning on ice fishing on Lake Minnetonka this winter with a friend and I am using a snowmobile to get to the lake from the trails. I would enter onto the lake in Orono off the Luce line trail and end up in Stubbs bay. I was reading on other forums saying avoid the channels but it seems to be the only way to get around the lake to other bays especially since I am on a snowmobile. I was wondering if they eventually are safe enough to hold up a snowmobile in mid-late January, and if going through them faster helps possibly? I would like to fish around the Smith's bay area and the only way I can do that is going through channels. I know Lake Minnetonka can be sketchy with ice thickness and I don't want to end up through the ice, thoughts? Thanks.   Jim
    • delcecchi
      The DSL service is great since they ran the fiber down 24 a few years ago.   I was presuming that the poster didn't have that option if they were considering satellite.     AccessMN is another possibility if they are still around.