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jlm

Black powder guns?

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jlm

Can anyone give me some suggestions on a decent black powder gun? I am not looking to spend a fortune and am unsure where to get the most bang for the buck. I would love to get the T/C Encore but don't want to spend that much. Any suggestions? Anyone using the new Winchester with the action break? Help please!

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irvingdog

The new Winchester "Break action" and the CVA 209 Optima Pro are the same gun for the most part. It is a great gun. I've shot most of the modern in-line ML's and this thing performs beautifully for the dollar, and is capable of handling magnum (150 gr) loads.
Depending on the variety, you can get even the top of this line (nickel/camo) for under 300 bucks. Worth every penny.

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HunterLee

Glad to see your intrested in blackpowder. We started last year and this year i am gonna use mine during regular season instead of my old shotgun. we got the Traditions Tracker 209. We got kinda a package deal from a local guy, but they were about 100 bucks for the black barrel and 105 for the stainless steel. It is very relible and shoot great. Shot it two nights ago and could hit a 6 in circle at 100 yds. open sights. so i would recommend this one beings our group consists of 6 of these and one cva. and we all could hit deer. good luck

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bigg edd

What every gun you get make sure you spend some time with it and get to know it.
I have been shooting black powder for 10 years now, deer hunting for 6.
If you are going to go with a inline (they have a fast twist- 1-28" or 1-32") you are better off shooting a conical or a sabot (a jacketed pistol bullet).
You might have to try several different bullets to find the "magic bullet" All three of my guns like something different.
Then you have the powder. real blackpowder is nasty stuff. try some of the new powders like 777 or clean shot. You will have to experiment wth different amounts.
One thing for sure is that you will not be able to just pour in some powder and ram bullet down and expect it to shoot like a smokeless gun. Finding the right combo of powder and bullet takes some time.
You can emil me @ monsterpikeonly@aol.com if you have any questions. hopefully I can help you. Once I started to shoot blackpowder I put all my other guns away!

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jlm

The CVA was actually one of the guns I was considering. Do you have to measure powder and the whole works or can you use the balls? I might run out and get one tonight. Is it worth getting the starter kit?

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Guest

Two years ago I got a cva hunter bolt 209. I got the gun for $189. It is a really good gun it never missed fired from the weather being to cold. Plus you have to spend around $75 to get the cleaning supplies, powder and bullets. My first shot on a deer ever and I dropped it with a gun that is under $200. I use a 209 primer with 777 50 grain pellets and powerbelt bullets.

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say_der

If you're going to get one - get it soon. You will need to practice with it. I hate the ads & commericals that make it seem like you can buy one off the shelf the night before the season opens.

The kits are a pretty good deal. But you can't be picky about your accessories obviously. I am picky. My first kit was an unfinished Traditions .50 cal, 1:48 twist (medium twist rate, can shoot patched round balls OK, does much better with conicals). It's a sidelock. Came with a powder measure, a couple of quick loaders, a powder flask (very cheesy one) and a bullet starter. Maybe there was a cleaning jag in there too. Anyway, I've since bought a different bullet starter, a much nicer powder flask (doesn't leak), and other various things I "need".

I've bought a couple bp pistols and another rifle since. The latest one was a CVA Hunterbolt Mag 209. This is a nice gun. I love it. There's something special about the sidelock since I built it and it's more of what the special muzzleloader season was meant for. But I'll probably carry the CVA this year because it's more accurate. I've shot a lot of different bullet/powder combo's with it and I've never been satisfied with it. I wouldn't take more than a 50 yard shot with it. I've never had a misfire in either gun.

Go handle a bunch of different ones. T/C makes nice stuff, so does Knight. Don't be afraid to try traditional stuff either. It can be just as or more accurate and reliable than the modern stuff. I've got friends that shoot T/C's that are older than me. They can outshoot me any day.

Have fun with it. Once you start it's a whole new can of worms that opens up and you'll never be the same again.

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ghotierman

Take a look at the T/C Omega too. Drop breech seals 209 primer. Simple, easy to breakdown and clean too.

------------------
Alexandria Outfitters
915 Hwy 29 N NE
Alexandria, MN 56308
(320) 763-9598

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Guest

The cva mag bolt 150/26 .45 cal. that's a pretty darn good gun. I bought one this summer and have been practicing. Pretty good grops at a 100 yds with pyrodex and powerbelt bullets. With that combo it's easy to clean, too. Great gun for $150 excluding cleaning tools, shooting utensils.

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jlm

Ok guys, I went out to purchase a gun after doing my research. CVA was by far the best bang for the buck as they say. However, when I told the sales person what I wanted, he tried to talk me out of buying the CVA guns because they have been having some pretty serious problems with them. In particular, they are rusting from the inside out. He pulled a bunch out of the boxes (brand new guns) and a least half af them had rust and serious pitting in the rifling and inside the barrel. I asked about the return policy and they basically said there is no return policy with guns, you buy it you can't return it. I decided to wait to see what you guys think. Anyone out there have problems with their CVA's? Have you checked the inside of your barrel? Is it worth the risk or should I look a different brand? What do you think?

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bigg edd

I have been told the same thing about the lower end cva guns. I also know people who own them have not had any problems.

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jlm

It was not justthe lower end guns, I check all of them from the most expensive to the least and all models had problems, even the nickel plated ones which surprised me. I am not sure if I should take the risk or not!

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SCCO9803

Are you looking to for a modern style of muzzleloader or more traditional. I own a Thompson Center .50 cal Hawken and I love it. It offers the traditional feel and look and definitely makes deer hunting interesting. I have never had any problems with the firearm and would definitely suggest TC to anybody. It is also extremely accurate with the open sights and even cooler with the traditional brass scope. If its a mix of nastalgia and seriousness you want you want this firearm.

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SCCO9803

By the way, I have been looking to by a long brass scope for my Hawken. Does anybody know of a retailer that might sell one? I've checked the major ones, but I might need to go to a gun show.

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Guest

after reading the comments on the CVA guns, I had to go and check mine. I bought an Optima .50cal about 1 1/2 months ago. I see no rusting or pitting on it anywhere, except the breech plug, and I think that is my fault. It's been in the gun case for a couple of weeks now, and I left the plug in it. I think the proper way to store it is with the plug out. I'm very happy with the groups it shoots. By the way, mine is the nickel barrled one with a 26" barrel, and can shoot 4" groups, or less, at 75 yards

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Iron Cowboy

I have a CVA hunterbolt that I have put about 50 rounds thru. I have no rust problems.
just make sure to use 777 powder and not pyrodex. it has no sulfer and is way less corrosive, plus no rotten egg smell! Aldar not to be a smart guy or anything but That gun of yours should get better groups than that. After the first shot and the barrel is fouled I can hold 1 inch groups at 75 yards and 1 to 2 inch at 100. I had accuracy problems too till I talked to a veteran of the smokepoles. dumped the pellets and powerbelts and went with loose powder and Dead Center sobots from Precision Rifle. Man what a difference, cant say enough good things about them. To get the groups im getting out of a $150 gun. No deer is safe now!

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bigg edd

Hey SCCO9803,
Dixie gun works has the brass scopes your looking for but they aint cheap!!!

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fishface5

Sorry to add a bit of contraversy, BUT "I think", in-lines defeat the purpose of a muzzleloader seson! If you're going to use an in-line you might as well just use a single shot rifle, that's all they are. The traditinal or repro's. have that element of will itgo offor won't it? That's why we got the special season. It's a tad on the risky side, but lots of fun.

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SCCO9803

Hey Bigg Edd, thanks for the info on the brass scopes thats exactly what I'm looking for.

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jlm

Well I went ahead and bought an Optima and have had no problems to speak of yet. It is very accurate and I am very pleased with it. Real cheap sights is about my only complaint, I broke one by modestly tightening the screw and had to buy another. Oh well. Tight groups at 50 yards and good groups at 100 yards. Tough to get good groups beyond that without a scope cause of the size of the front sight. I did hit the target on all attempts at 150 yards. Very fun to shoot!

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Iron Cowboy

jlm, From everything Ive read about the optima it sound like you bought a real good gun. did you get the optima pro? If you dont mind saying what did you pay for it? When you get a chance go to the cva website. they have an awesom forum that I have learned a lot from. lots of optima talk too.

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Gissert

I was looking at some muzzleloaders this weekend. Has anyone had a chance to use the new Savage units?

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Borch

Every gun is different. Mine likes the 295 gr HP Power Belts and 100 gr of 777 pelets. 1.5-2" at 100 yards. Took my 4 pt buck with it during the firearms season.

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iffwalleyes

I heard about this a while ago but I can't find one. I heard of a conversion kit that you could used to make a shotgun into a muzzleloader. The guy I knew had a 11 87 that he used. I have a model 1100 and was woundering if anyone knows where I can find one of these and if they make one for a 1100. If someone could let me know where to find one of these it would be appreciated.

------------------
Grip it and Rip it

IFFWalleyes
I Fish For Walleyes
iffwalleyes@yahoo.com

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