Is seafoam really a good idea?

[Gadgetman]

I have recently had some problems with my chainsaw and my 15 horse 4 stroke Yamaha and both places (different businesses) brought the use of seafoam into question stating that it has alcohol in it and is raising the amt of al cohol in the fuel over an ecceptable amt. I have always been a seafoam guy but am begining to wonder. Anybody else getting the same line? the chainsaw tech told me to dump any gas that was over a month old and mix a new batch, saying that due to the high rev of a chain saw that old gas is a bad thing seafoam or not. I am very confused. what to do what to do wack a du wack a due

[boatfixer]

I believe the alcohol in seafoam is isopropol, which is fine. It is the same as in HEAT or other deicing agents. The alcohol to stay away from as much as possible is ethanol. A different type of alcohol, used to boost octane. Most shops I know of will tell you stay away from "tune up in a can" be cause they want to make a little money, tuneing up up your motors the old fashioned way. In no way does seafoam fix everything, but it is a good thing to try at first.

[Jeremy airjer W]

Seafoam does not contain "isopropyl" it uses "isopropynal".

This post had a lot of good info and testimonials, including the info below. Seafoam Question

Seafoam Motor Tune is a pure petroleum product. This allows it to be used in 2 and 4 stroke engines as well as oil systems and gasoline/diesel fuel systems.

There are three ingredients in Motor Tune.

The first is a naptha based solvent. This is a common product found in many popular fuel injector cleaner. Its primary function is to melt gums, varnishes and residues left behind in fuel and oil systems.

Isopropynal, not to be confused with isopropyl, is the high test base oil used to make isopropyl. Isopropynal is the drying agent of Motor Tune. It removes moisture by emulsification which breaks down water into oxygen and hydrogen and allows it to be “burned” in the combustion chamber. Although it will not remove large quantities of water from the fuel system it is the most effective way of removing the moisture.

The last is pale oil (100/100 sec – I have no idea what that means, apparently it is some kind of refinement identification) which is a highly refined oil. This is the upper cylinder lubricant and/or where it gets its lubricating properties (this is also why Deep Creep is such a good penetrating lube). Pale oil is highly heat resistant. When blended with the above it makes everything more heat resistant. This allows all of the chemicals of the product to make it further into the intake/combustion areas of the engine.

[vermilionfox]

Airjer,

I checked the MSDS on the Seafoam website Seafoam contains IPA, Isopropanol,or Isopropyl Alcohol (all are the same).

I have never encountered Isopropynal. Had to do a little looking, but couldn't find any info on it. I checked all the chemical dictionaries that I know of.

[Jeremy airjer W]

I spoke with a gentleman at seafoam for the info. He said they where not the same thing although one is used in the making of the other. Isopropyl will absorb moisture and carry it to the combustion chamber. Isopropynol breaks the moister down into oxygen and hydrogen. again straight from the guys at seafoam!

Spelling has never been my thing!!

[Ralph Wiggum]

Well, on the MSDS they have listed IPA which is isopropanol or isopropyl alcohol (same thing). I would have to believe (and hope) they aren't providing false info on an MSDS. Although I have no doubt what this gentleman told you, Airjer, I have never heard of isopropynal/isopropynol, nor have I been able to find any record of such a compound.

Regardless, like mentioned, IPA is way different than ethanol, which is what people get all worked up about. As one poster mentioned, IPA is the stuff that makes IsoHEAT work.

[Jeremy airjer W]

I just talked to Dick at Seafoam again. He said they are definitely not the same thing. Isopropal was the result of the further refining of the isopropynal. I am not a chemist so I really don't know if they are or are not but I'm sure Dick would explain it to you as he did to me. They are really nice folks to talk to!!

[boatfixer]

Getting back to the original question, if you were to look into fuel stabilizers, such as 2+4, or Stabil, you would find that they consist of 70 - 80% ISO. I was told a few years back by the fuel system engineers at Mercury Marine that their fuel conditioner contained 73%. It is the carrying agent for the chemicals that stabilize the fuel for storage. Ask the guy that told you that Seafoam is bad, what he thinks about Stabil.

[Ralph Wiggum]

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I am not a chemist...

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I am

I'd be very interested in why they list IPA on their MSDS and what this "other compound" is.

[Dahitman44]

My personal mechanic uses it on every 2 and 4 stroke out there. he has said with how bad the gas is today it is a good idea. We also put it into our classic car.

From what I have found out it is a good idea.

[sparcebag]

Isopropynol breaks the moister down into oxygen and hydrogen. again straight from the guys at seafoam!

This would solve the problem for hydrogen burning engines,the problem being cheap effiecent way to seperate hydrogen from water!

[jigging-matt]

The guy that I take all of my small engine work to recommends seafoam in all of my 2 stroke engine mixes, and says it isn't a bad idea for the 4 strokes also.

[vermilionfox]

First off let me say that Seafoam is a great product. I'm not sure that all the info about Isopropynol is true.

I think I have found some more info. It appears that Isopropynol is/was a trade name for Isopropyl Alcohol used by Ashland Chemical.

As for the Isopropynol causing a breaking of chemical bonds (dissociation) in a water molecule, I don't think that's true. I believe that can only happen in a combustion chamber (engine) when the water is dissolved in the alcohol (Isopropyl) base. Otherwise I don't think an engine has enough heat to cause the dissociation.

[Northlander]

I run it a few times a season. Maybe 6-8 tanks a season. It was recomended by the dealer to always run stabil. I go through gas very fast so is it worth putting stabil in my tank if it gets burned up in 2-4 days?

[Payday]

If you are running your tanks out in 2-4 days I wouldn't think you'd need Sta-Bil. Most people don't burn the gas in their vehicles that fast and sta-bil isn't needed in them

[DinkADunk]

If gas is going to be in a tank more than 30 days then add Stabil (or similar) when you fill the tank with gas (not later).

[Dahitman44]

Right on.

[backlash 1]

Ralph W.

A large boat dealeaship in Brainerd told me to stay away from Seafoam in the marine application, but stabil is OK.

I have a funny feeling you know more about this ???

[Ralph Wiggum]

Quote:

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Ralph W.

A large boat dealeaship in Brainerd told me to stay away from Seafoam in the marine application, but stabil is OK.

I have a funny feeling you know more about this ???

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Nope, sorry! I'm just interested as a chemist

[Surface Tension]

If your using your gas up then theres no reason to use any additive. Look at Seafoams intended use. #1 as a decarb for the engine. You don't have to do that every tank. Once a year should be plenty. Stabil's intended use is for storage of gas. Seafoam claims the same. So if your not going to use your gas up within 30 days then its a good idea to use one or the other. I use Stabil because thats what its made for, storing gas.

When you put an additive in your gas you have to wonder how that'll effect atomization and detonation. So is any additive in every tank a good idea? I don't think so. Use it for its intended purpose.

[Gadgetman]

Due to kid responsibilities I generally get out several times early in the year and then a couiple of times again after baseball/softball season is done and before pheasant season starts. The gas I put in at the beginging of the year is often in there all summer long ( I have a 50 gallon tank ) I put seafoam in as I put it in and hope for the best. The 15 horse that had the problem gets more use than my big boat but often times the gas in there may be more than 30 days old too. Do you just keep dumping it in to your car gas tank to keep the boat gas fresh or whats a guy to do. These new gas mixtures really suck The reality of my situation (and others I am sure) is I dont know how much gas I am going to need/use so I fill the tank and hope to use it but often end up with aging gas (no pun intended) sitting in the tank, and I think that is when the fun begins. I wasnt really looking to start a discussion about the chemical composition of the product,(couldnt care less what it is if it works) just wondering how many others have been steered away from it for any reason.

[theoilman]

Every few weeks there seems to be a new thread about Seafoam. I have had many people ask me what Seafoam is and how it works. Airjer on page 1 of this thread definitely has the best technical about it. He seems to have found someone at the company that was really helpful - hard to find anywhere, he has done a great job.

As to recommending it, today's gasolines because of several different reasons start to deteriorate noticably within 30 to 45 days. If you use the tank or can of gasoline before then you don't need a preservative. A lot of gumming and corrosion in all types of small engine carburetors can be eliminated by using fuel preservatives in the off season or any 30 day plus of non-use. Many of the outboard carburetor/fuel system problems I have read in quite a few other threads may have been non-existant with the use of the right additive.

Another problem, detergents/cleaners/dispersants - All the gasoline refiners, distributers, retailers etc. have cut all the possible corners and reduced the additives to the lowest levels they can get away with, some much worse than others. All gasoline today needs extra help in this area.

Is Seafoam the right product to do this? Is it the best? Many people successfully use it as a "cure-all" - a lot of testamonials in a lot of different threads over the last several months. I have never personally used it, but now that I have learned what it is, I would be less afraid of it.

However, my preference is to use several different products each targeted to do specific jobs. (Yes, AMSOIL makes several, but I will not go into commercial info here. Contact me privately for info on them.)

[fishinalot]

I've been mixing every gas tank I own with 1 ounce of seafoam per gallon for the past 15 years, and have never had a carb problem! All my chainsaws, outboards, lawnmowers, and ATVs ! That product is the best stuff for any and all 2-stroke & 4-stroke motors.

[sparcebag]

I have not been using it for 35 yrs. and all my machines never have carb problems I just do general maintance on my motors!

[Scott K]

I havent been using it, and I havent had a problem.

[1Yogi]

I am not a Chemist I am a cook, but I know this, All Alcohols are Azeotropes. That means that they cannot exist without a small amount of water in them. The Alcohol in Seafoam and other products is to "attach" itself to excess water in the fuel system this then allows the water to "Burn" out with the rest of the fuel. It also provides that the excess water in the fuel system will not freeze blocking the fuel line.

This is the emulsion process refered to earlier in the thread. emulsions need a "Binding" agent to emulsify. the alcohol is the binding agent with the fuel and the water.

Gas and water do not mix, alcohol and gas do mix as do alcohol and water. use the alcohol to bind with the water and it will mix with the gas.

As for useing it I do use Seafoam at least onec a season usually when I put the outboard away for the winter, cleans all the Gunk out before I store it and means less prep time in the Spring. JMHO is all no proof of that.

[Slyster]

I bought a BRAND new 15hp 2 stroke Johnson motor in 2004 and in just 3 years the carb was totally gummed up and needed an overhaul... with using regular ethanol gas. I KNOW that if I would have added SeaFoam I wouldn't have had to cancel a day of fishing and spend a hundred bucks to clean it out.

And I DID do all the standard maintenance on this motor.

Now I use both SeaFoam and also non-oxy gas. I would bet anyone I won't ever have this carb problem again. Although I am not sure which is more important.. the non-oxy gas or the SeaFoam.. but doing both will be the ticket..

[delcecchi]

The breaking down water part sounds like baloney to me. It may bind to the water, causing it to disperse in the gas and be run through the engine, but breaking down into hydrogen and oxygen? They ought to be ashamed saying that. This is not an opinion as to whether seafoam has beneficial effects.

[Ralph Wiggum]

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...but breaking down into hydrogen and oxygen? They ought to be ashamed saying that.

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Yeah, you'd have to add a ton of energy to break water down into hydrogen and oxygen--not something a bottle of Seafoam could do.

[LaXCarp]

I think its called spontaneous dissociation when alcohol and water mix, the H20 breaks apart and bonds with molecules in the alcohol. I think thats what they mean by "bind"...Atleast I think I learned that in chem

[delcecchi]

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when alcohol and water mix, the H20 breaks apart and bonds with molecules in the alcohol. I think thats what they mean by "bind"...Atleast I think I learned that in chem

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Oh my, I hope you didn't learn that in chemistry because it is not true. Metallic sodium will rip apart the water molecules and form sodium hydroxide and hydrogen. But if alcohol did that you would notice some commotion. And a shot of whiskey would be even more dangerous than it is...